$1200 ME halfway through day 1 with JJ - MTT Poker Strategy

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$1200 ME halfway through day 1 with JJ

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02-23-2020 , 03:35 AM

Evil eyes120

newbie

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 22

Day 1b Live $1200 MTT (8 handed)

Blinds are 600/1200 with Big blind ante
Starting stack 50,000

Hero mid 20s Caucasian, possibly viewed as fishy/ rec player. Table is pretty tight with many 3 bets getting through.

Hero (80k effective), in the cutoff with JJ opens to 2500.
Villian (youngish looking pro, TAG) on button 3 bets to 8200. Folds to Hero?

I’m unsure on how to proceed. Folding seems nitty, calling seems polarizing, and raising seems meh :/

Hero?

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02-23-2020 , 07:05 AM

auralex14

veteran

Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 2,924

Call.

What do you mean it’s polarizing?

What does the Villain have behind?

Mid 20 yr old Caucasians are generally not seen as fishy recs btw, just a heads up—unless you have your Affliction t-shirt and True Religion jeans on

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02-23-2020 , 10:07 AM

daviid

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,639

not rly looking to get in close to 70 bigs in that spot readless. since folding is not an option we should be calling mostly.

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02-23-2020 , 01:28 PM

TylerPhillipsPkr

newbie

Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 32

Easy Call. I'd flat Aces a decent amount here too.

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02-23-2020 , 01:28 PM

fatmanonguitar

veteran

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 2,990

Calling is the opposite of “polarized”. We would generally 4-bet a polarized range and call with a condensed range.

Can call here this deep and play post-flop despite being OOP. If we were 40bb effective I would just 4-bet jam.

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02-23-2020 , 02:57 PM

Evil eyes120

newbie

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 22

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatmanonguitar

ok I think I see what you’re saying. In my mind at the time calling this 3 bet seemed like polarizing my hand to like 99s-JJs and AK, and kinda still does, but I guess my calling range could be wider since the pot would only be about 19k and we would still have ~72k behind.

anyyyyway, Hero elects to 4 bet to 22k. I don’t think it’s a great idea to see a flop OOP with a hand like this. Was hoping to take it down here but unfortunately V 5bet jammed for Hero’s effective stack. V had ~100k to start the hand, if it matters.

First, I know a few of you guys wanted a call, how bad actually was this 4 bet?
Second, do we make the call?

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02-23-2020 , 03:04 PM

Evil eyes120

newbie

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 22

Quote:

Originally Posted by auralex14

Lol never the true religion jeans, naw I was playing a lot of hands and it kinda seemed like many of the players knew each other. I knew several but doubt anyone knew me, I guess that doesn’t always make me fishy, although I am new to playing these bigger buyin events and thought that may have been known.

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02-23-2020 , 03:32 PM

wynner88888

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2018 Posts: 1,330

Dude, I’m not sure about playing $1200 bi’s if you don’t know what the word polarised means yet you use it anyway..

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02-23-2020 , 04:48 PM

Areevaderchi

banned

Join Date: Jan 2020 Posts: 142

Quote:

Originally Posted by daviid

not rly looking to get in close to 70 bigs in that spot readless. since folding is not an option we should be calling mostly.

you need to change your location then.

26,666/c at shitty parx

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02-23-2020 , 04:58 PM

#10

TylerPhillipsPkr

newbie

Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evil eyes120

First, I know a few of you guys wanted a call, how bad actually was this 4 bet?
Second, do we make the call?

Pretty (Really) Bad

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02-23-2020 , 06:56 PM

#11

cito

centurion

Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 124

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evil eyes120

At equilibrium (60bb deep, co open+bu 3x 3b, we are mixing 4b shoves and 4b non all in (calling a 5b shove). In a live mtt, I probably lean towards flatting more unless I think V is capable of some light 5b (A5s/A8s for example which are close to 5b shoves at EQ) and for V to be capable of this, his perception of you has to be that you have some weak 4bs, which in reality is quite rare in live <5ks these days except in reg vs reg spots.

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02-23-2020 , 07:32 PM

#12

Evil eyes120

newbie

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 22

[QUOTE=TylerPhillipsPkr;55852452]Pretty (Really) Bad[/QUOTE

Care to elaborate? I just wanna know the thought process here

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02-23-2020 , 07:41 PM

#13

Evil eyes120

newbie

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 22

Quote:

Originally Posted by cito

I haven’t 4 bet yet at this table, I 3 bet jammed with a short (~20BB) stack the previous level with AKo and got the call and doubled through a different player. I do in fact rarely 4 bet bluff, and I’m 3 and 4 betting AA and KK almost 100% as I think I should be, considering I’ve been slightly more active than the average bear at this table. Maybe if I were a nit I could flat big premiums here.

As played are you advocating for a call?

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02-23-2020 , 11:30 PM

#14

cito

centurion

Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 124

As played, you need to call 58 to win 163 equating to roughly 35.6% equity. If we assume V is ONLY 5b shoving QQ+ and AK, JJ is 36.19%. It would be a marginally +cEV call.

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02-24-2020 , 02:16 AM

#15

daviid

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,639

Quote:

Originally Posted by cito

As played, you need to call 58 to win 163 equating to roughly 35.6% equity. If we assume V is ONLY 5b shoving QQ+ and AK, JJ is 36.19%. It would be a marginally +cEV call.

we have to call 58 to win 83 not 163.

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02-24-2020 , 09:08 AM

#16

cito

centurion

Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 124

Quote:

Originally Posted by daviid

we have to call 58 to win 83 not 163.

That is not how you calculate equity needed to make a call. If we are going to call 58 more, we need to have >58/163 equity to be a +cEV call.

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02-24-2020 , 09:06 PM

#17

PhatPots

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 4,028

I think I would sometimes call here and take a flop. I don't mind 4 betting here. A pro is going to be 3 betting wide on the button. Especially if he thinks you might be stealing the blinds often.

I think at this stack depth calling the 3 bet is preferrable.

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02-24-2020 , 09:16 PM

#18

Jkpoker10

veteran

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 3,087

Think I would call here. Don’t see anything too wrong with 4b if
Villian is aggro. Villian should be 3betting fairly light here in a button vs cutoff spot and especially with shallower stacks.

Kinda like call bc we can keep air in and allow Villian to bluff per se. Really can’t see anything wrong with 4bet or call here. Really depends on Villians image and how hero is perceived.

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02-25-2020 , 01:55 AM

#19

oldsilver

MTTLivePro

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 5,955

JJ shouldn’t be part of any 4b/f range
Call or 4/c depends on V
Call as played

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02-25-2020 , 09:48 AM

#20

Black Thought

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 537

any non-folding option works, but in a late/late dynamic vs this type of villain (and given the image you perceive him to have of you), 4b/c prints

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02-25-2020 , 01:11 PM

#21

cito

centurion

Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 124

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldsilver

JJ shouldn’t be part of any 4b/f range
Call or 4/c depends on V
Call as played

At equilibrium, sure. However, I've made some pretty ridiculous folds pre vs recs where I dont have enough chips to set mine w QQ/JJ vs a range that I know is always AA/KK when I take a certain line.

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02-25-2020 , 06:19 PM

#22

Evil eyes120

newbie

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 22

Thanks guys, Hero went into the tank for a few minutes and then folded. Villian immediately showed a 7 and Hero gave the immediate, extra annoyingly loud “nice hand” before crying inside. Walter asked and was told he had A7s. Should have went with this spot after being results oriented, wanted to see if you guys thought the same

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02-25-2020 , 08:48 PM

#23

Evil eyes120

newbie

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 22

Later asked*

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02-26-2020 , 12:28 AM

#24

deuceblocker

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 4,785

Why ask? I would be happy with JJ against any hand with a 7 in it. A7s is about the worst case 7 for you. 4!/f is pretty bad. 4!/gii or flat are both fine. You really shouldn't 4!/fold value hands, at least against a player like that. I don't like his play either. You can't bluff allin.

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02-26-2020 , 12:45 AM

#25

Evil eyes120

newbie

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 22

Quote:

Originally Posted by deuceblocker

As soon as he showed the 7 I knew it was either 77 or A7, i was just making conversation later on and asked why he decided to go for it there.

I really thought I was up against a monster at the time :/

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