No. Just no. I've lived in London for 40 years and in a part of Tower Hamlets for 10 years which was majority Muslim, and although the communities didn't mix much there was no tension or crime between them, so I really don't know what you mean.

I agree that integration between the communities could be better, but these things take generations to change.

Where in London were you?

You say the areas weren't really no-go zones but somehow people "knew" never to walk there at night. Why?

It appears you are right -- the most concentrated muslim neighborhoods are 50% muslim. The area I am referring to is a few blocks away from the Aldgate East station. I had a female friend who worked in the financial district and sometimes walked home to their apartment (that was near this neighborhood). They would always say how they were never comfortable at night.

We need a video of Chez walking through this "no go zone" and beforehand we can bet the over under of how many stones get tossed and how many fingers get lost.

this is super interesting to me. to me, a no go zone would be defined by police not responding at all to reports of crime. in the US, i believe, this doesn't exist. there are places under policed and places where police are sadly slow to respond, but no place where the cops simply ignore.

The problem with this anecdotal stuff is that it's so subjective - maybe your friends had their own biases and irrational fears that they weren't recognising.

Basically you're talking about the area around Brick Lane/Whitechapel and New Rd/Commercial Rd. This is so absurd the fault is with your friend.

A group of us were there just before Christmas, trawling around a few pubs after a curry. None would have recognised it from your (friend's?) description.

Female uncomfortable at night is a no go zone lolz? I guess like every US city and most suburbs are also no go zones too.

In the UK a no go area refers to the public, not the emergency services. That would usually be qualified by "No go area for police" etc.

That is a fair point. But, this was a commonly held opinion among people that I came across while living in London. I lived in Chelsea and wasn't too familiar with the neighborhood in question. I truly want to be as objective as possible. But, to say this isn't an issue in Europe is foolish.

so what does that mean? what happens if I go to one of these no go zones?

unfortunately, this means almost anywhere is a no go zone.

but clearly that's not what people are freaking out about when it comes to muslim neighborhoods in europe?

I was trying to be polite and succinct with word choose. Men would physically get in her way and talk to her in Arabic.

There aren't any in London and I doubt there are many in the rest of the UK.

Some parts of Glasgow are often cited, but they fall into the "no go areas for emergency services" under certain conditions, and in any case are irrelevant to this thread because they don't have a significant number of Muslims.

i cannot help but actually laugh at this example. Men would actually talk to her in Arabic?

That can't be true.

so they don't exist, correct?

i am now curious about these parts of glasgow you mention.

I don't know if you are being sarcastic and saying this isn't a big deal or if you think this doesn't happen. If it is the latter you live a sheltered life. It has happened to me many times.

His (jwd) example was that a female friend felt uncomfortable at night in this so called Muslim no go zone in London. That's what I was replying to.

I believe so, but not having personally been to every dump in the UK (life's too short) I can't be 100% sure about it. I can say I'd be extremely surprised, having lived in some of the roughest parts of London over the years (eg riot-torn Tottenham and Brixton in the 80's).

The Easterhouse area of Glasgow is the one usually cited.

UBI for Easterhouse? will give you an overview and a pic.

(There are plans to give the area an overhaul: Transformation of Easterhouse)

i am being sarcastic in the sense that being talked to in Arabic is not a big deal.

But I also realize that you have a problem with the way women are treated within the muslim community and i, too, am baffled by our western liberals being so apologetic for that culture and its treatments of queers and bitches.


nonetheless, i am looking to hear those anecdotal stories of muslim immigrants having an effect on western societies. i'm just interested at this point.

i live in vegas and see no impact. nor have i seen an impact in any of the places i've visited in the US.

Did you personally witness men physically getting in her way?

Mat, to be totally fair here, how often are you calling the police about a stabbing in one of the worst streets of Detroit?

It's hard to understand these types of descriptions of situations unless you've actually seen it or experienced it. Years ago someone made a comment of people moving into an apartment at 3am to avoid their neighbors eyeing up their stuff. No one really understood it, but I laughed because I've witnessed it firsthand.

You shouldn't understand what he's describing, you live a good life in a decently safe environment. That's a good thing. But don't dismiss it as untrue because you've never seen it.

I can link some videos to describe the vast differences in understanding between different groups of people to prove my point, if you wish.

My perspective, we are often arguing that all Muslims are not terrorists and all Muslims shouldn't be blamed for the acts of the few. I don't believe many (maybe any) liberals excuse the poor treatment of women and gays. That is pretty much a straw man.

I'm perplexed why conservatives are so concerned about Muslim women and treatment of gays when they have been steadfastly against the advancement of gay and female rights in the West. Seems to be an argument of convenience.

Wil's Anecdotes!

They don't seem to understand that is Muslims aren't defunding planned parenthood.

i think i completely agree with you. it's very troubling that this is happening in our country or anywhere (never implied it wasn't reality), but we're not referring to them as no go zones and using them as examples of how a certain type of person is destroying our country. i don't think we are, anyway.

Europe has a whole ugly history of far right racist parties gaining power that the US doesn't have.

I think the fear of encouraging supporters of these parties that this history has engendered explains why European liberals are sometimes slow to denounce sexist and homophobic attitudes when they're found in Muslim communities.