edit:master thought of Vader too, i'm so glad And i really used to hate Ted DiBiase as a kid, thinking back now i'd say Money Inc are probably the greatest heel tag champions ever. Please add to that debate if you so wish

Bedreviter, you a big Cena fan?

The best feud i ever saw Steiner in at TNA was against the former X Div champ Petey Williams. And he mostly destroyed him. If TNA wasnt 100% terrible they wouldnt have fired Petey and had him go over in the end to massive good feelings and happy times.

The bad guys are always at their best when they have the upper hand for a while then the plucky underdog good guy wins in the end. Its a classic story predating pro wrestling by several millennia.

We all knew in the end Kong would do the job at big PPVs to Kelly Kelly, Beth Phoenix and Nattie Neidhart or whoever the next big babyface is that could realistically beat them for various storyline reasons. But the ride along the way would be fun getting to see bitches get killed and Kong would have made a HUGE star out of Kelly Kelly from it and helped make Beth look uber strong when she scoop slammed Kong or Nattie when she german suplexed her.

Oh and fwiw im actually pretty excited to see Mark Henry being used better as a monster heel squashing some dudes like Daniel Bryan and Sin Cara then ultimately putting them over. That is what wrestlers do. The big difference however is Kong has never had a career where she repeatedly jobbed out, unlike Henry.

funny this conversation comes up because I just watched the match where Simmons beat Vader in 92 earlier today. Match is very good btw. It was a shocking ending at the time because as mike said Vader was unstoppable and destroyed Sting at the GAB a month before and nobody thought he would lose the title so quick (he had a knee injury though ).

Hmm...I hadn't thought of it like that. I guess I do think that Kong's squashes are a lot more interesting than other squashes. I'm not sure why...maybe b/c it's so rare to see WWE's women get decisively destroyed? And I guess it's interesting to see that happen? That's how the Dudleys got over back in the day, they just went around putting random women through tables, and they started getting cheered so much they turned face.

ding ding

also, kong is legit one of the best womens wrestlers in the world. right on the level with sara del rey and mschif.

Kharma is the most interesting thing to happen to the WWE women's division in a long time. It's a shame she had to go and get preggers. And yes, she is definitely one of the best in the world, if not the best. I prefer Kong to Delray for sure.

Breaking News - WWE signs

I guess this is their solution for everyone botching Sin Caras moves.

Beats the **** out of Chavo.

This is pretty cool. Sin Cara isnt getting over the way most had hoped, and you can blame that on people botching but he also doesn't have the mic skills or charisma needed to be in a feud with anybody who can really put him over big at this point. Bring in Averno and do a big feud, then when the opportunity arises he should be in a big program with Alberto. Obviously the matches everyone wants to see are the potential matches with Rey, but that's not even close to feasible until SC gets over more. I think they would do just fine with a Bryan Danielson heel turn and feud, but i guess it's not in the cards right now.

I still have no idea how they go about doing a significant feud including Sin Cara right now.

WWE's model of doing things really isn't conducive to a major angle where one side never ever cuts a promo and doesn't have a manager either.

Yeah, its a serious problem for him. It's times like these I really miss Jamie Noble.

I was really encouraged by the Danielson/Cody match on Smackdown. They are pushing Cody hard (as well they should) and for him to drop a clean pinfall to Bryan at this point suggests a lot about future directions.

Not that Bryan will be pushed hard per se, his main job is to make other people look good, but he has to build credibility in order to do so, and that requires wins and titles.

They did just do a huge angle where neither side ever cut a promo. (almost)

Amplify, that is way easier to do with two established main event guys then with a new face. I'm also not sure what you're referring to. I initially thought Taker and HHH but their feud did have a few promos.

If they are bringing in Averno as a heel primarily to feud with Sin Cara then pairing him with Chavo who can act as a manager is the uber easy way to get him over and progress the story with words plus they can continue the current story bringing him on screen straight away. I dont think a face needs to talk when they arent feuding at the top of the card, we have learned this with Rey who can PG-babyface it with the best of them despite never talking during feuds, a one sided promo feud can be done if its written correctly and none of us give a **** if the promos are terrible when the ring work is luchawesome.

They did...?

Rey cuts really bad/lame/stupid promos, but not being able to cut them at all is a significant difference. I mean, I'm fine with it if the matches are good, but that's not how the biggest chunk of the fanbase is programmed as far as I can tell.

ok ok there eventually were promos in the HHH/Taker feud

btw how ****ing long does it take to learn enough English to cut a short promo? I'm pretty sure I could cut a promo in Spanish on about a week's notice.

Just watching Cody vs Bryan from SD, Cody is so ****ing good right now. Id love a feud with him and Bryan but id much more prefer him being moved up to take on Orton for the title.

They should be able to have him do a prerecorded backstage one, sure.

But how long has Khali been in the WWE without cutting a promo (and i mean properly cutting a promo).

Khali is a giant monster, and usually a heel. Those guys don't need promos to get over. Plus, he's always had a manager.

and he's only 25.

down on his (padless) knees praying to see an even mildy attractive face was epic. "shut up and bag yourselves!" "I am exposing your deficiency of desirability!"

all great stuff.