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Best Turns of All Time - Draft Thread Best Turns of All Time - Draft Thread

02-24-2018 , 12:28 PM
BEST TURNS OF ALL TIME - THE DRAFT



The Rules:

Competitors will draft the best turns in wrestling history, whether face to heel or heel to face.

Rough criteria for value:
*Points for execution of the turn itself - how well the segment or segment(s) constituting the turn went, whether the turn was logical and made sense, and whether the immediate follow-up to the turn was done well.
*Points for how well the turn got over in the long run. If the turn fell flat over time, the turn isn't worth as much.
*1.5x multiplier for face turns. Great face turns are a rarer species, and they tend to have a lower peak than great heel turns as well, so this multiplier should be taken into consideration.
*Points for good writeups. A, uhh, frequent past drafter tended to just vomit five words out and press "send," so you are encouraged to do better. YT clips when available, some explanation selling the value of your pick, etc.
*In the event of a selection from a double turn, you only get one of the two turns with one pick. You, and every other drafter, are still entitled to pick the other with a separate selection.

Framework:
*12-hour clock. No dead zones. Commissioner reserves the right to reduce a player's time clock if the player gets skipped too many times. As a courtesy, please PM the next player in line to let them know they're up. However, it's up to each player to track the thread and make timely picks, whether they get a PM or not. (Also I don't really want PMs; I'll see the bumped thread first. Others can feel free to opt out the same way.)
*Snake draft - ABBAABBA, etc.
*No set number of rounds - we'll draft until people seem to lose interest in drafting. At that point, I'll open it up to any poster to name undrafteds. Until then, please everyone refrain from mentioning or strongly alluding to specific undrafteds.

Spreadsheet

Last edited by LKJ; 02-25-2018 at 07:25 PM.
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02-24-2018 , 12:28 PM
Our field of competitors (not yet randed into order):

LKJ
eyebooger
Poncharello
gs3737
True North
yankeys316
mflip
Dylan
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02-24-2018 , 12:33 PM


Oh get the **** out of here, giving me True North as a draft neighbor.

Anyway, PMing gs3737 now. He will be first on the clock.
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02-24-2018 , 01:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LKJ
Oh get the **** out of here, giving me True North as a draft neighbor.
Mazel tov!
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02-24-2018 , 02:27 PM
Just out of curiosity: trading allowed?
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02-24-2018 , 02:41 PM
Sure.
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02-24-2018 , 02:42 PM
Oh, and I'll put this in the OP, but: we'll just draft until it seems to organically wind down to the death of the draft, at which point I'll open up the floor to anyone, players or railers alike, to name undrafteds that perhaps should have gone.
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02-24-2018 , 02:47 PM
I'm pretty sure of where I'm going with number one, but willing to listen to
Offers.
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02-24-2018 , 02:56 PM
Man I hate being #3, even if True North weren't #2.

I thought about sending you an offer gs, but I would be trading up to take something that I'm halfway second-guessing myself for even having at #1 overall. Think I'll stand pat.
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02-24-2018 , 03:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gs3737
I'm pretty sure of where I'm going with number one, but willing to listen to
Offers.
I’d be open to trade if you’d rather pick at the end of the round.
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02-24-2018 , 03:24 PM
I think I'm gonna stand pat. I hate waiting til end of second round to pick again but
Doubt I'll get value for #1 overall, which is a pretty easy pick imo.
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02-24-2018 , 03:51 PM
Slam dunk #1 pick imo:

Spoiler:
Hogan is the third man


Scott Hall and Kevin Nash left the WWE in 1996, and were signed by WCW. They started to appear on WCW programming, and were portrayed as still being with WWF and coming to WCW as an "invasion" of sorts. They challenged WCW to a match at Bash At The Beach on July 7th, 1996. Hall and Nash had a mysterious "third man", and were to face the WCW trio is Sting, Savage and Luger.

During the match, Luger left with an injury, leaving it a 2-2 match. As Hall and Nash got the upper hand, Hulk Hogan walked down the aisle, and since this was 1996, everyone assumed he was there to assist Savage and Sting. After chasing Hall and Nash from the ring, Hogan backed into the corner and gave Savage the leg drop. The crowd was shocked. The announcers were shocked. The trio disposed of Sting and the ref, Hogan have Savage another leg drop and Hall mockingly made the three count. The fans started throwing trash into the ring, and Mean Gene went to get an interview:



(This is easily my favorite work of Hogan. Referencing WWF, his move to WCW, totally turning on the fans. It was great stuff).

This checked the boxes of execution and long term effect. Hogan, the face of faces, the man of the people, turned on them. It was surprising (for the time) and a total 180 from the character Hogan portrayed at the time. The great character of Hollywood Hogan was born.

From a long term perspective, this started the NWO, which was largely responsible for shifting the power from WWF to WCW. Though it eventually went to **** (like everything in WCW), the effects of this turn were long lasting.

Pick 1.1: Hogan is the "third man" and forms the NWO
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02-24-2018 , 03:52 PM
Yep, that's certainly what I'd have gone with.

I certainly can't name another heel turn that got mainstream news coverage. Hogan turning heel was unthinkable (even if I was hoping for it during the run-up to that event).
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02-24-2018 , 04:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LKJ
*Snake draft - ABBAABBA, etc.
This is a weird draft order fwiw, normal snake is ABABA etc.

Hogan super obv #1
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02-24-2018 , 04:10 PM
Err, maybe I'm getting the term wrong? Or maybe I should have just used an additional letter. It's ABCCBAABCCBA, etc.
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02-24-2018 , 04:16 PM
yeah that looks good, my bad, thought you meant A was 1-8 and B 8-1
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02-24-2018 , 04:17 PM
Maybe the most obvious number 1 pick in any draft we’ve ever done. I also think the promo Hogan cut that night might be the greatest promo he ever gave.
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02-24-2018 , 04:54 PM
Several great parts to that promo:

- "Bischoff would still be selling MEAT out of a truck in Minneapolis" The stress on the word meat really drives the point home about what exactly it is that Bischoff would be selling.
- "Whatcha gonna do, when the New World Organization runs wild on you"
- Mean Gene hits with the biased take... "You've made the wrong decision in my opinion."
- Nash sees a Mcdonalds wrapper coming at him at about 3:55 and swats it.
- Hogan runs the wrong way before his last leg drop.
- Heenan
- Hall and Nash both doing Hogan's poses while Hogan speaks
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02-24-2018 , 05:04 PM
Schiavone was great in that segment as well. > Heenan
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02-24-2018 , 05:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dylan
I also think the promo Hogan cut that night might be the greatest promo he ever gave.


(I agree with you though.)
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02-24-2018 , 05:06 PM
I’ll pick early this evening, torn between the one I want to pick and the one I should pick.
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02-24-2018 , 05:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dylan
Maybe the most obvious number 1 pick in any draft we’ve ever done. I also think the promo Hogan cut that night might be the greatest promo he ever gave.
That's because he probably believed every word.

(I can't do these drafts anymore because I'm often going multiple days without internet access.)
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02-24-2018 , 08:22 PM
Ah, screw it. I’d be foolish not to take this one...

Spoiler:
Round 1, Pick 2: Steve Austin turns his way into megastardom


Spoiler:
The background:

After being criminally misused as The Ringmaster following his arrival from WCW, Steve Austin had generated some momentum over the course of 1996. He started with an unplanned King of the Ring win, where he uttered the catchphrase that would eventually sell a million T-shirts:



Following that, he started running down and challenging the WWF’s quintessential babyface Bret Hart, who was MIA following his WWF title loss to Shawn Michaels at WrestleMania 12. The Hitman would finally come back in the fall to announce his WWF return, and accepted the Austin challenge for Survivor Series, where he would prevail in an extremely entertaining back-and-forth match. Bret expected that he would move on from Austin and focus on recapturing the WWF title.

Austin had other plans.

First, Austin interfered in a title match between Bret and Sid at the December In Your House PPV. Then, Austin literally stole the Royal Rumble from Bret, coming back into the ring unnoticed after being eliminated and dumping Bret to claim the victory:



Bret was becoming increasingly unhinged over Austin’s antics, ranting continually about getting screwed and even quitting the WWF for a night following the Royal Rumble. All seemed to be ok after Bret was granted a spot in a four-way title match including Austin, Vader and the Undertaker, with Bret finally claiming his fourth WWF title. But it lasted only one day, as Austin delivered the coup de grace the following night on Raw:

http://www.wwe.com/videos/bret-hart-...bruary-17-1997

Bret had had enough, and a grudge match between the two was set for WrestleMania 13 — a submission match.




The turn

Bret and Austin tore into each other from the opening bell. They went all over the ringside area, using chairs, the steel steps, the ringpost figure four, an electrical cable, and finally the ring bell in their assault. The crowd was starting to get behind Stone Cold more and more as the match wore on. Austin bladed, and his face was a bloody mess as they built to the climax, with Bret Hart locking Austin in the sharpshooter. Austin, using all his strength left, powered out of the hold, with an instantly iconic visual:



But Austin had not escaped fully, and the Hitman reapplied the hold in the middle of the ring, causing Austin to pass out. Bret was awarded the match, but was viciously booed after continuing to attack Austin after the bell. Austin awoke and, refusing all help, made his way to the back to a thunderous ovation. The WWF’s most dastardly heel was suddenly its top babyface.

The aftermath:

Somewhat substantial, I’d say. Austin continued his feud with Bret Hart and his newly reformed Hart Foundation over the summer, as a warmup for winning the WWF title at WrestleMania 14. From there, Austin’s feud with Vince McMahon lit the industry on fire, saving the company from bankruptcy, propelling the WWF to dominance over WCW (and eventually, the entire wrestling world) that they would never relinquish. Austin himself became arguably the biggest draw in the history of wrestling. This and the previous pick have to be considered 1 and 1a.


Team:
Spoiler:
Steve Austin turns face at WrestleMania 13
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02-24-2018 , 09:52 PM
I rewatched that match earlier today. It’s probably not fair to compare the current product to it, since it’s widely considered one of the greatest WWE matches ever. I was just struck with how it had everything that’s currently missing from today’s matches. Intensity, unpredictability, originality, announcers putting over both wrestlers, storylines advancing, and so much more.
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02-24-2018 , 10:33 PM
Yeah I was quietly rooting for True North to follow his heart and pass on that one in favor of a more personal favorite. Given that it qualifies for the 1.5x multiplier as a face turn, I think it's closer to the Hogan heel turn than others seem to (though I've still got Hogan heel turn at #1 and it would have surely been my choice in that spot as well).

There's a pretty big drop to #3 regardless of what I take. My mind is mostly made up, but give me a few.
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