hey All, new to stud8 im playing for pennies right now but enjoy the game.

One problem ive been seeing is that im donking off my chips chasing for low hands too far after 4th street. what can i do to stop that? past couple nights ive lost 1/4 of my stack because of this. I ve been playing very low micro stakes to start


here is an example ( although not a great one)


Hero gets dealt 5,8,A
Villain(call him right villain) to the right gets dealt x,x,K
Villain(left villain) to my left gets dealt x,x10

some villain with an 8 showing ( which is literally the lowest hand showing at a 7 handed table brings it in,



right villain completes,
i call
left villain calls

every one else folds


4th street

right villain has x,x,K,K
Hero 5,8,A,4
left villain x,x,10,2

right villain bets, i call, left villain calls

my thought process is im drawing for low and hope the other two villain duke it out for high, I cant fold because i feel i have tons of live cards and making a low wins half the pot which should be big with these two going after it


5th street comes and i get high card, both villains catch good and I keep calling all the way down to river never making my low and left villain ends up winning with two pair Aces and 7s.




This has happened to me past couple nights where i donk off half my stack chasing after 4th trying to catch ONE more good card with 3 streets to come. I KNOW I should be playing for scoops but at these micro stakes I feel like I know generally where im at and If I see a opportunity where I can get an easy half of the pot while two obv high hands are duking it out I should see draws.


is it incorrect to do this? im assuming it is and i should fold on 5th as soon as I catch bad regardless?

IMO just knowing your draw odds v pot odds provides the answer here. 10 outs after 5th is 46% to catch, 14 outs is 65%.

I created a tool for stud practice, it really only works on a computer or tablet (read: not good on a phone) --

http://openfaceodds.com/sandbox_stud_deal.html#

it deals out a full stud ring (8 hands) and then you can take two hands, set them up against each other, deal out 4th-7th. Odds chart is on the page, both for single-out needed and runner-runner. One day I'll put together 3 and 4 players going all the way to 7th, but in the meantime this is pretty good for basic practice.

thanks. I guess it would be an odds question but do i calculate half the pot since im only going to win half?

Correct, your full bets to win half the pot if you're clearly up against high only hands.

Of course there are many variants of this, 3-handed 4-handed

If anyone else has worked out some shorthand of doing this, I'd be curious to hear

Pro poker tools can calculate the equity though you will need to work with the ranges for it be accurate - sadly no hand rankings available

You can't dimiss any chance of winning the high. You can make straights, trips, flushes, 2 pair that sometimes win hi.

From the hand described it doesn't sound like you did anything wrong, though you might consider raising preflop

3 bet pre or fold

yeah im really passive.i need to look to be more aggressive on 3rd with HU type hands


I def have big time trouble on 5th street when I catch bad but think I can win half the pot EASY if I draw out. even at the micros I know where I satnd usually ( its not that hard at the 4/8cent levels) but **** damn do I lose a TON of money on 5th street by making bad decisions.

I need to start really looking at pot odds closely then. I get caught with the TRAP rule that was talked about in SS I, I should re read that book and re assess

I've played thousands of hands at those levels 10c/20c and below, and discovered you will get smashed by the rake via my fpdb, even with that poor standard of play the opponents have.

Avoid those games if you want to make money. Build some money outside poker and load it up, play at 25c/50c or above.

Great Post Lucius,
A lot of new players to the game of live poker never even consider the rake. Game selection is rule number one, and evaluating the rake is key.

damn really?

Raise third here some of the time.

If this was higher stakes then raise third 100% of the time or fold.

As played hand is fine. Would never fold a free roll to the bottom vs two high only hands like ever.

but if you catch bad on 5th street, is it still correct to chase?

I promise you, I would be crushing the game if it wasn't for rake. After rake I was a loser, and quite obviously I played better than my opponents. I played tighter than them, folded in way more spots than them that they should be folding, value betting where they weren't in spots they should, and I still wasn't winning. It really is insane, the rake at those levels, like >2 BB's per 100 hands insane. Big bets in limit poker are a really big deal. I'm pretty sure it's more actually but I would have to get my DB up to look and post it on the thread.

Think about it. IIRC the rake is like 5% capped at $2. Play a 2 dollar pot at 10c/20c and you are paying 1 big bet in rake. Factor in that most pots are split, and you are on a losing proposition before you've even sat down.

Trust me, don't bother. It's fine to learn the game, but I'd honestly recommend Stars home games or play money, because at least then you aren't guaranteed to lose money long term.

In general depends on how much money went in on 3rd and 4th street, reads and what not. If third is limped and 4th is checked or maybe just bet once then I would consider a fold. Though if third and fourth have full bets from 3 players i'm never folding 5th in a spot like this vs two high hands ever even with a brick. Only caveat would be if all the low cards we needed were dead that others had folded.

In the hand in OP yes, never folding on a bricked out 5th vs these two hands ever.

very very interesting.

at the stakes I play with, its obv that when Im put in a situation like this on 5th, im up against two highs 90+% of the time ( its easier to sniff out at lower stakes imo) and because of that, thats why I was unsure about hands like this. especially if on 5th one high best and the other calls.

you said it profitable to call so I may have to re think things and call more here