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Razz .25/.5 - Did I fall in love with bet button? Razz .25/.5 - Did I fall in love with bet button?

04-18-2008 , 07:38 AM
I suspect I played very poorly 6th and River.
Villains were both terrible and started with more than bricks, that's why I bet on river... but I still have doubts.

Is it better a check on 6th with bet on the river or no bet on the river?

Razz ($0.25/$0.50), Ante $0.05, Bring-In $0.10 (converter)

3rd Street - (1.40 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx 7___calls___calls
Seat 3: xx xx 8___folds
Hero: 5 3 A___completes
Seat 5: xx xx 4___calls
Seat 6: xx xx Q___brings-in___folds
Seat 7: xx xx 9___folds
Seat 8: xx xx 6___calls___calls

4th Street - (5.80 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx 7 2___calls
Hero: 5 3 A 2___bets
Seat 5: xx xx 4 K___calls
Seat 8: xx xx 6 T___folds

5th Street - (4.40 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx 7 2 6___checks___calls
Hero: 5 3 A 2 2___bets
Seat 5: xx xx 4 K 6___calls

6th Street - (7.40 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx 7 2 6 K___checks___calls
Hero: 5 3 A 2 2 2___bets
Seat 5: xx xx 4 K 6 8___calls

River - (10.40 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx 7 2 6 K xx___checks___calls
Hero: 5 3 A 2 2 2 8___bets
Seat 5: xx xx 4 K 6 8 xx___calls

Total pot: (13.40 BB - $6.70)
Razz .25/.5 - Did I fall in love with bet button? Quote
04-18-2008 , 11:44 AM
These sorts of hands are pretty common in the micro/low stakes universe (i. e., multiway, bad opponents, started good, went bad)--I have trouble with them also.

On 6th, you are in great shape if both opponents are playing bricks:
Code:
Hand 	Pot equity
53A222 	41.77%
Q3726K 	38.36%
Q34K68 	19.88%
But not so good if one of them actually has a hand:
Code:
Hand 	Pot equity
53A222 	25.80%
Q3726K 	25.11%
734K68 	49.09%
Seat 1 loudly announced on 5th that he has a brick or pair. Therefore, given your read that these guys play lots of really bad starting hands, I am OK with betting 6th, as long as you think seat 5 is a really big calling station--for him to have a brick he had to call a complete on third and then call again on 4th when he gets his 2nd brick and you apparently catch good. Unless he is unusually horrible, you are putting him on something like TA in the hole.

I have trouble pulling the trigger on the river against 2 opponents--I would happily value bet 1 bad opponent in a similar spot. I can certainly see the argument for value betting the river:
  1. Seat 5 is very unlikely to have you beaten because he would have raised a made 8 on 6th street.
  2. If seat 1 was drawing to a 7 (which is not certain) he didn't have all that many outs (7 outs = something like 20%). If he did make a 7, he would probably bet it.
OK, now I think the river value bet is pretty good, because these guys are going to call with all sorts of hands like J low, etc.
Razz .25/.5 - Did I fall in love with bet button? Quote
04-19-2008 , 06:46 AM
Everything you wrote is exactly what I thought during the hand... and that's the problem (including bad feelings about value betting a multiway pot on the river).

Basically those people played in a so strange way that guy onSeat1 had a made 7 on 5th... and he SLOW-(!!!)-played in that way.
As Not Lolo wrote in another post... God bless him.

I was just trying to figure out if I could avoid a situation like that but I start to think that it is just impossible.
Razz .25/.5 - Did I fall in love with bet button? Quote
04-19-2008 , 10:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip753
Everything you wrote is exactly what I thought during the hand... and that's the problem (including bad feelings about value betting a multiway pot on the river).

Basically those people played in a so strange way that guy onSeat1 had a made 7 on 5th... and he SLOW-(!!!)-played in that way.
As Not Lolo wrote in another post... God bless him.

I was just trying to figure out if I could avoid a situation like that but I start to think that it is just impossible.
One way to avoid this is to make a note on the Seat 1 guy. Note that Seat 1 just called the river closing the action. He wasn't slow playing--he had no idea where he stood. (It is also possible that he knew he was ahead on 5th and 6th and was afraid you hit your 4 outer.)

When I was replying, I had a feeling that one of those guys was playing a big hand passively. This is always a danger at the micros, where some people don't have much clue about the value of their hand and others would rather trap someone than get the max value from a big hand. I wouldn't feel bad about how I played this hand.
Razz .25/.5 - Did I fall in love with bet button? Quote
04-19-2008 , 11:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eratosthenes
One way to avoid this is to make a note on the Seat 1 guy. Note that Seat 1 just called the river closing the action. He wasn't slow playing--he had no idea where he stood. (It is also possible that he knew he was ahead on 5th and 6th and was afraid you hit your 4 outer.)
Exactly what I did.

About slow(!!!)playing... I was just joking. I completely agree with you: he had no idea about the whole situation.
The funny thing is that he seemed one of the more decent players in that moment at the table... I let you imagine the average...
Razz .25/.5 - Did I fall in love with bet button? Quote

      
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