Hey Frankie, just wanted to say thanks for having a presence here, it's great to see.

It's unfortunate, however, to see that the stellar management begins and ends with you. I played the morning tournament today, and a player (plater 1, let's say) at my table flopped and a set. A second player went all in. Player 1 said "call" and flipped his cards. Player 2, allegedly believing that player 1 was folding, mucked his hand and began pulling the pot towards him. Player 1, and two others at the table immediately verbalized the mistake. The dealer immediately knew he had a problem on his hands and called the manager over. Multiple players at the table repeated that player 1 had called. Player 2 was asked what he'd been holding and said "I don't remember." Tom ruled that the pot be split. He said that since the cards weren't face-up when he arrived at the table, having been thrown into the muck by player 2, that he was entitled to half the chips. This is a frightening message to send to players. A lawless casino is no better than a basement home game. If a player can escape a bad hand simply by grabbing at the pot, better dealers and managers are essential. Like I said, I want to play at TS as it's the best room in upstate New York, but it can't be that type of environment. The hand in question cost me nothing, but the precedent is frightening.

Sorry for the delay, been away a few days. Early interest has been good, we should be at or slightly above last years numbers, having 2 WSOP Final table players here is going to be fun considering they are both players that started out playing here at Turning Stone! Hope to see you here.

Thank you sir, always good to hear!

Hi TS, Thank you for bringing this to my attention, it took some time but I was able to review the incident on film and talk to staff and players on the game. There are a couple things on film and after talking to players on the game that were a bit different than described. The hand unfolded as stated, whether the player called or not is not determinable as there is no sound on film. According to the film, player 2 did not pull the pot towards him but rather the DEALER, in error, PUSHED the pot to him. At that point, the supervisor is called to the table and the cards are all pushed together. There are no discernible hands at this point for him to look at. According to the PLAYERS I spoke to, the only usable information the supervisor received was from the dealer and not any players. The supervisor had to make a decision based on not seeing anyone's' hand and not knowing what anyone had in their hand at the time the incident happened. No one stated who won the hand nor did anyone state who had what cards in their hand. At this point, the supervisor faced with a pot between 2 players with no cards to determine the outcome made the decision to split the pot.
We are far from a "lawless casino" and I take exception with that remark, there are rules in place, about 80 pages worth between Cash play and Tournament play in the poker room alone not to mention the thousands of pages that are covered property wide. When a supervisor is called to a table to make a ruling and there is no way to reconstruct what was on the game at the time of the incident, he has to make a judgment call. Had he been able to verify and confirm every aspect of the situation I'm sure the call would have been different. When the decision is up to the supervisor in that type of situation he is charged to "make the best decision at the time based on the confirmable information available and in the fairness of the game" which I believe, according to the video and in talking to other players on the game, the supervisor did. Going to the camera during a tournament is not the norm as it takes too long at times and in this case would not have been conclusive without sound. The situation will be addressed with the dealer as well as all staff members to prevent future incidents. The hand was not compromised by a player grabbing at the pot, it was compromised by the pot being pushed in error by the dealer and further compounded by the inability to correctly reconstruct the hand. That has nothing to do with room environment. Unfortunately mistakes happen. It was an error that will be addressed and dealt with.
Anyone who plays here knows that I have an open door policy for staff and players alike. If you would like to continue this conversation in a private setting and talk more about the situation I would be more than happy to make time to do so the next time you are here. I am usually off Mon and Tues, other than that I am here. I look forward to speaking with you in person. Thank you!

Thanks for the response, Frankie, I appreciate the effort you put into chasing this all down.

Then what are we talking about? The player verbally called. Players at the table heard it. I understand that technology limitations exist, but a dealer who was paying attention to the game would've avoided the need to even go to the tape.

It was the supervisor's choice to not ask the players. We were a captive audience, after all.

Were you there on Saturday? I asked for you by name and was blackballed at the desk. "Anyone in a suit is a manager, you can talk to them." I'll try again next time.

Like I said, thanks for looking into it. I guess you and I just have different takes on the same situation. I totally understand that mistakes happen, but this was an extremely preventable mistake followed by, at best, managerial indifference. I hope the guy got his money back at least.

I agree 100% that it was dealer error and should have never happened. I stated that in other post. But once it did, it is a difficult situation that has to be dealt with. Asking the players is not always a viable solution, sometimes yes, but not always (friends, collusion, opinions etc...) I still believe that the best decision was made considering the circumstances and the information available on the table as far as being able to read hands. If there was managerial indifference on the supervisors part than that is another issue apart from the decision. I was not here on Saturday, I was in NJ. I do apologize for the remark you said you received at the desk. I would like some more info on that. Please ask for me the next time you are here, like I said, I will make time to meet with you. Thanks!

Frankie,

All in all I've seen a good job ran during the main event. Kudos to you and your staff.

One thing that bothered me is that your dealers were pushing pots before mucking the cards.. I understand a called pot means both hands are live, as well as checking the river. I understand it hasn't a lot with the dealers, more the horrible etiquette of some of the players, but after checking the flop and the other player mucks his cards, the pot is pushed THEN the winner of the hand asks to see the cards... Correct me if I am wrong and I'll apologize if I am wrong, but are dealers supposed to muck the cards before gathering the pot and then pushing to someone? If that is the case, can you please have the dealers do that from now on? I know it's a super minor thing but if we are trying to promote the game, it would help against the bad etiquette and give rec players a bad taste in their mouth.

Thanks

Frankie

I have a few questions about tomorrow $570 tourney for Poker Night In America Tour

1) Poker room or ballroom ?
2) Approx time of dinner break ?
3) Approx time of end of day 1 ?

Thanks

Hi Nemo, the $570 on both days will be in the poker room. dinner break will be from 530pm to 615pm. Day 1 will play thru level 17. See you Tomorrow!

hi Mascot, you are correct, the dealer should kill the losing hand prior to pushing the pot. In the case you stated, the losing hand left on the board can be asked to be seen by the winner but if that request is made the folded(losing) hand is again live so there is a bit of a risk on the winners part asking to see the losers cards. We had some new dealers in this event and I'm assuming some of our experienced folks may have slipped but be assured we have addressed this situation with our dealing staff. Sometimes refresher reminders are needed and I thank you for bringing it to my attention. That aside, I hope you had an enjoyable time!

Thanks Frankie one more quick question i purchased my ticket on pokertickets.com do i need to see the tourney reg disk or the cage inside the poker room to pick up my seat ticket ?

Sorry Nemo, I got this message late. For future reference, you should always go to the cage for tickets purchased online. Thanks!

Thanks Frankie may i suggest using more then just the tourney clock in the corner perhaps at least the one in the middle as well

Hi Nemo, we normally do utilize the middle clock for events. However there are times, such as if we are having another event later that day, that we only use the corner clock so that the side clock will be available when the second event starts.. Hope you had an enjoyable time. Thank you for coming out!

October poker weekend looks good

Nice to see someone in here!!! Thank you G,should shape up to be an awesome event! hope to see you here!

Just a overdue shout out to thank the floors, and particularly NoGimmicks (not allowed to name names here, right?), for the work they have been doing in the room lately. The removal and checking of the decks when the shufflers report an error is truly world class.

But seriously, there have been a more than a couple of times in the past year when something has needed attention from the floor and they have resolved the issue quickly and professionally. Thanks to all (and you too Frank) for making the room a pleasure to play in.

Agreed. The room vastly improves by the week and it's well equipped now with bravo, auto shufflers and USB chargers on the tables. I see more hands per hour and the new white chip rule at the 2/5 tables makes for much less hassle. We'll done as usual, Frank. I'm a long time reg at T.S. and the room is far better than ever before. Who is nogimmicks? Send a pm if you don't want to be outed.

whats the new white chip rule?

White chips now play in an all-in situation where as before they were not. It will also require a red chip on the 2/5 game to hold your seat not just 2 or 3 white. Players were tying up seats leaving the white chips on the game and not coming back crating a situation where we were wasting time picking up the couple white chips they left. See you soon nedprz!

Thank you gentlemen for your loyal play, we appreciate the kind words and for noticing!

thats great news. thank you frankie for the quick response

how much is first expected to be?

Looking at last year, the total payout was well over $125K. First place will be decided by the amount of players that actually play in the tournament. Last year 4 players chopped $104K so I would guestimate had it played out to finish top prize would have been around $35K. Hope to see you here!

Hi Frankie,

I know you guys traditionally do a tournament series around the Thanksgiving holiday. Will there be another one this year, and if so, when do you think the schedule will be posted? Thanks!