If the hand was tabled then it is protected from the muck. In otherwords he could have tabled his cards, then after the river was dealt, thrown his hand into the muck and walked away frustrated and he still should be awarded the pot.

It obvious when you think about it- the winning hand should get the pot when it is absolutely obvious and verifiable to everyone what the winning hand is.

It unusual in some points.

1. Generally there is no qualifier for the "leg up", or the first pot won- only the kill pot should have the qualifier.

2. $20 seems too small of a pot at 3/6 to trigger a kill pot. Generally it is somewhere between 5-10x the big bet. So at 3/6 $30-$40 to make it a kill would be make more sense.

3. (but this goes back to #1) If you win three pots, and say it was $28, then $10, then $23- it should be a kill pot if only $20 is needed to kill it. if the killer wins a pot in between that is less than the qualifying amount- it should still count as a leg up.

I just came back from Delaware Park. Gee, 191 runners. They had to start with 160 and 30 alternates, which they eventually got in and because they were running 16 torunament tables, had to add a chair to each to have some cash playing. Chopped three ways at 1500 plus each. 20 places paid and that wasn't until 6:30 or 7.

You can't log into your account on line. You could do that, until they changed the system in May. And they haven't got the on line frictional yet. I think they should take the page down for log on until they get the system up. I'm not sure it would give you hours though. The points are worth .20 and I'm kind of sure you get .40 per hour. So, I guess it's 80 points to get to the free roll.

I'll be in Indianapolis all week, but hope to get to the room on Friday night. I need to log hours in too. I've easily done 40 in July and August, but my day job has me on the road in September and it could end up a stretch.

I don't think that's standard most places- is that the rule at DP?

That's the difference between a kill and a straddle. A kill plays in position, typically... at least, that's how I understand it.

Why are tournament players called "runners" ?

Cause a tournament is like a race?

I don't knw the rules at DP because they don't usually have an 0maha Hi-Lo game running when I play there. I love playing $4/$8 Omaha H/L with a half kill and would play a similar game at DP in a second.

Anyway, it makes sense that the rules for the kill would be different at different rooms, since straddle rules vary from room to room, kill pot rules would too I guess.

Everywhere Ive ever played an $4/$8 Omaha 1/2 kill game (which is all over the west coast, east coast and a few places in between), a kill pot happens anytime someone scooped a pot over $80. Then the scooper had to post a $6 blind. Action started from under the gun, and went in normal sequence- but it would skip past the killer until everyone acted- and then the killer had last option. However, if someone raised before the killer had their option then action just went in normal sequence and the killer lost the option of acting last.

This is different from the DP straddle where action starts to the left of the straddler, which means they would get act last regardless.

Ok - let's look at that. 6 see flop of a kill hand (playing a 6/12). $36 in pot. Pops with 77 checks, I bet top pair (or maybe he put me on 2nd pair, but that was still better than his 7s), 2 other callers. Pop's decision.

$6 to call, $54 minus $5 rake in the pot. 49 - 6 odds, or just over 8 - 1.

Odds of hitting tripson turn: around 23 - 1. If it hits, and *ALL* 3 other players stay in for 1 bet each on turn *AND* river, he could win $72 more. So implied odds say for $6, he would win $121, if his 23-1 shot hits. 6*23=138. Maybe he gets to throw in a raise, but on the other hand I doubt all 3 players will stick around to the end.

Well, at least it went to a nice guy, even if he did get lucky on the hand.

Do I graduate on to Implied Odds 102? Or at least get a C- in I.O 101?

Okay, I overstated it a tad... and I confused your "completed" with "raising", rather than just limping as you evidently did.

Still, there's possible fold equity involved, at least one raise (if he doesn't lead out from the SB, as played evidently) AND you could be CB-ing the flop.
You made it seem as if the call was redonkilous, after you completed in the BB with King-crap and led out on the King-high, and I didn't see a one-bet call here by the 77 as hugely bad.

I'm less bothered by his flop call than I am your preflop limp with King-crap off. With those callers, I'd be worried about being dominated... or being forced to fold the best hand, or pay off a better one, by the river. If the table was so donkalicious that you were only second-best to the set, it's not hard to anticipate getting more callers than one would normally expect.

But, I probably sux at the pokahs....

Actually, I hadn't done any math like that in a while and I just felt like double checking. And yeah, completing with K2 is often a pretty bad play with exactly the problems you mentioned, but I was counting on the implied odds!

You might be failing "Reverse Implied Odds 101".... but I'm out of the grading busines for today

I have asked about the origin of room rules with some of the floor staff. They have all said that with the exception of their straddle rule, that they are trying to mirror the top rooms in Vegas with regard to everything else. I assume rules related to "kill" or "half kill" (which can't be played at 3/6, but could be at 4/8 or with even number blinds) pots are the same as those of the Venetian in Vegas. I don't know this, but as Anthony came from that environment and they play kill games, it doesn't figure he'd make new rules up as he went along. I realize that even the top rooms may have slight variations in rules, but I will guarantee you, that if it's a rule at DP, it is the general rule at the better rooms in Vegas.......except the Mississippi straddle, which is unique.

I hope Omaha Hi/Lo gets going earlier on Saturday, September 11. I willbe going to DP to play and am hoping the game will start by noon-1 p.m.. If there are enough players they will start it, otherwise all the table get filled up with NL. Please sign up if you are interested.

We had a nice game last weekend.

Are you talking about the 5/10 nl Omaha hi/lo. I could play 5/10 limit, but nl is out of my league (willingness to live with the risk of losing 1500). I saw a poster complain about the dealers in that game, which really surprised me. Maybe sounded like he lost and didn't like the dealers for it. I know the guys they let spread the Omaha hi/lo game are really good....to a person. I'm going over to DP tomorrow, probably from the airport just to get my fix since I've maaged an early flight. Thursday's can be a little funny in that they are sometimes busy and occasionally, not so much. Maybe the Borgata WPT will affect the crowd too. I'll try to get over on Saturday as well and will put myself on most mixed games list. Particularly interested in Pineapple. I may not get there as early as 1PM, but should be there by 4 PM

I'm in Indy now and they only have live "e" poker here at a place named "Indiana Live". I almost went to play it, but just couldn't get up for it after reading the threads on the game and reviews of the number generator and "poker tech" tables. Something about a deck, a dealer and a cut that makes the game better for me. Just didn't feel much like sitting at a table, cupping my hand to see a screen to see my cards and betting off a machine. No dealer, no floor, no rulings, no overhead, a 5.00 max plus bbj rake so , no fair.

I will try to get there at noon. Any interest in 8 or better sit n go's

3-6, 4-8 would be my first choices on Limit Omaha hi/lo.

Except for the BBJ drop.

But seriously folks. What's the typical number of runners for the weekday 11 a.m.? How long has it been lasting each day? (Yes, I know someone reported a number above, but that was for a holiday weekend, not a typical weekday.)

Ok...I've seen a few updates of 3/6 pineapple running here...what are the odds of getting a 1/2 or 2/5 NL pineapple or crazy pineapple game running here?

Please read the thread before posting. 2/5 NLP has already run @ DP multiple times.

What is different about the bbj drop except they add the mini and freeroll. They take bbj drop only at 20.00 pots.

Um, the top rooms in vegas don't have a bbj?

I had an opportunity to introduce myself to Anthony Chester and I broke my anonymity to him. I'm trying to protect my identity at DP simply because I post so often. As I told Anthony, some of it is selfish as I want players to play DP because it offers us all options. He gave me a lot of "talk time" and he helped me better understand what they're trying to do at DP. Some of the information was new to me and of course as many 2 plus 2 er's know, not everything I've posted on this thread has been dead on. I knew Anthony came from The Venetian (12 years), but did not know his assistant (who's name I can't mention without breaking 2 plus 2 guidelines) came from the Bellagio. Arguably two of the best run rooms in the country. I also didn't know that Anthony was part of the management team who opened the Borgata, years ago when they had a basement room. I used to play there and wait the two hours plus for a table. I think he may have been the room manager when it opened (not sure of that). He's been extremely busy with state approvals, construction of the new room, hiring floors/dealers and that's why he hasn't been too visible on the site as of late, but he has a lot of respect for two plus two as a site and for the participants/posters. He knows being a part of this community is good for DP and for us.The new room will open on September 30 and he is keeping stats on what percentage of players in the tournaments play cash when the tournament is over for them. The bravo system gives him all the data. He also is updating $15,000 free roll hours daily and has a group of players who have already qualified. BTW, I did sneak into the new room again. Security hasn't bothered me yet. Carpets there and it looks GREAT......... ahhhhhh when playing my NFL parlay. (at the risk of completely losing "Lottery Larry's" respect. At my table I heard a guy played a 400.00 seven team parlay.....gee. I played 20.00 bucks on three teams, because I can't lose all of the parlays I bet... or can I? Maybe I need darts to get a winner....can't be worse than my picks the last 12 months.

I asked him about the 3/6 horse ante issue and he is kicking around a number of ideas, including a dealer 3.00 ante. He understands that the 1.00 ante may be too high for 3/6 and that's why he has been trying to spread 5/10 horse. He also would like to see cash play in some games, but the state has to give approvals for him to do that. in fact Delware lottery officials must approve just about anything new, which is undoubtedly a complicated and work intensive process. I did ask about comp drinks, but that's a law that is going to be a bear to break down. I like drunk players, but not enough to run a tab at 1/2.

I have no doubt that this will be the best run room outside of Vegas and dare I include most of the AC rooms. Obviously, Stan does a great job with the Borgata and their long standing reputation as "Ruler of the East" will continue because of the size, WPT events and number of NY players who make the trip to AC. But, this management staff is going to try to make DP stand out. Hats off to the people who hired these guys, because they'd have problems if they weren't as proactive as they are. It's hard to compete with "15 mins to Chester", as it is with the large philly crowd. But, I came in to Philly airpoirt from a business trip and made it to DP from the Chester exit in less than 15 mins. Never thought of stopping into Harrahs. I've had my fill of learning what sardines feel like.

I wish I could mention names on this thread of DP floor supervisors who go out of their way to be helpful to players. There are a group who have worked in AC that will do anything to please their customer base and more than a few who've I've come to know and respect.

Logged in four and a half hours today and only need 27 more this month to be a regular. See you tomorrow night.

True, but some do and it's a thing in the east they'd have trouble getting away from. I think that's why they spread the opportunity to recover that buck drop, with the room payout, mini and freeroll....all out of the dollar drop.

100 has become the norm.... at least last week and before. I have no idea about this week expcet for the overcrowded Monday. Prolly around 5/6 hours or more.

Granted, he should search the thread... but read 1400+ posts? Setting the standards a tad high, aren't we?

93 today

it lasted over 5 hours iirc