There are currently a number of HUD threads on the front page, which seems a bit pointless. Setting up and getting started with a HUD is always a favourite topic of posters new and old, so this thread can be a single resource to group everything together, making it easier for newcomers to MTTSNG forum to find everything in one place. Ask whatever you want in here, and any new threads will be merged into this one.



You might also find further helpful discussion stuff in the following places

• on the HEM forum - http://forums.holdemmanager.com/
• on the PT3 forum - http://www.pokertracker.com/forums/
• in the 2+2 HEM thread - http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/16...-tracker-1535/
• in the 2+2 PT3 thread - http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/16...-trial-115744/

Hi guys!

what stats should I use on my HUD?

I have VPIP/PFR/3b/Fto3b/ then 2nd panel is AGG factor/steal/Ftosteal/limp/hands

and these 2 panels is too much for my eyes and looks like **** when I'm 9to12tabling

Which stats should I use cause I'm 9 to 12 tabling and need them as simpler as possible. (though I dont wanna loose any of previous mentioned information)

Or can som1 send me his HUD file which is appropriate???

Simlpy decisions guys???

Too much and mostly probably unnecessary.
a) Don't really think a HUD is even absolutely necessary
b) If you do use one, unless you can filter for higher blind levels, by position, etc, then a lot of the stats like 3b/fold to 3b are pretty irrelevant/borderline useless. You will rarely ever get a decent enough sample for these stats to be worthwhile and even when you do, you have to understand that these stats are often incorrectly skewed. Some regs will have a 3-bet of around 2-3% at 10/20 but nearly 10 at 500/1000 etc since re-shove stealing is much more common at later stages etc.. Simiarly some regs will have a FTS of 90%+ at 10/20 but less than 70% at higher blind levels etc. AGG factor prob doesn't really help often either etc

If you use a HUD, vpip/pfr is pretty much enough and even then it's basically exactly for distinguishing super nits or super donks, a 11/9 or 15/13 isn't gonna be that different for the most part in determining your decisions - whereas if someone is 50/0 it's good info to have.

Btw, 13/11 or 9/8 etc are somewhat standard stats for some good regulars simply because the stats you have will often be heavily weighted towards early game levels like 10/20, etc where most regs play very tight etc (which is fine), but often people make the mistake of seeing a players stats as 13/11 and thinking they are really tight - when in reality in the later stages many of these guys are good regs who are shoving very wide (like they should be).

Thnx dude!

This sounds pretty solid ... You seem to have great advice no matter what every thread I walk into Thanks! This is actually a question ive been struggling with myself.... To use HUD or not to use HUD...

Im aware that sample sizes are going to suck but Im just wondering if any increase in ROI could be noticed from using a HUD for an extended period .. How about starting a poll on who uses HUD's in MTTSNG ..

I use HUD and play the same stakes as you do. I found it very helpful cause you can identify weak players and I am making a lot of decisions based on the type of player. Also, you can identify game flow and let's say you have couple of nits on your left, so you can mr/f sometimes even 11bb deep, cause they'll never adjust. You can find spots w/ hud where you can take additional profit. It's so useful in these stakes, cause there is so much donkzzz and btw I'm using only VPIP/PFR and it's enough for sure, cause any other information is useless for me nowadays playing these stakes. Btw, I started playing these not long time ago,
so if you want to discuss strategy etc, pm me

OMGClayDol FOR MOD¡!¡!...I sense some green letter comming your way dude

Haha thanks, I appreciate that.

Anyway generally many players (especially the ones who actually use a HUD) will definitely find "significant" benefit from it, but in general most of the best players should feel fairly comfortable without one imo, at least for 180s specifically.

Some regs just don't use it because when they play 30+ tables or whatever their computer lags with the HUD on (me up until recently and a few others)...

Once again - I feel that in general most stats are either overrated or overused (like usually if you base your decision on how high a regs 3-bet percentage is, you are usually over-applying this, etc).

Notes/reads on players are much more useful - take notes on if a guy who limped AA, 3x/folded with 11BB, limp folded at BB/TX, etc. Mental notes help too.. As you move up, you will begin to recognise/remember regs more often, you will see things they do and hopefully remember, e.g. some regs will shove very wide when they are really short, if you see this - remember it and adjust accordingly.

Overall a HUD would help, but mostly for close decisions, and usually only if the guys stats are on the extreme (tight or loose).. If someone limps MP with 1,200 stack, you are on the BTN with QTo with 1,100, as a default it's probably quite close.. if he is 50/3 I'd now shove happily, if he were like 12/0 I'd probably now fold, etc..
Also, even a stat like steal over 500+ hands isn't going to be that good for the reasons I mentioned earlier - the sample size includes many hands at 10/20 where some regs will be extremely nitty with their co/btn ranges as opposed to their 500/1000 ranges or whatever. Once again, this might be something that can sway a close decision either way, if a guy has a pretty high/low steal % you might call/fold a close call when he shoves on the co/btn.

Now remember - the EV of a close decision is.. close! So in reality these close decisions don't really have a big impact on your ev/winrate/roi because the EV between folding/calling or shoving/folding etc is pretty close. So if your HUD helped you make a "better" decision in a close spot, the difference in EV once again isn't too big.

It's not like if the BTN shoves for 10BB post ante and you have AKs you're going to need a HUD to help you. (Obviously folding here would be way <EV than calling)

Usually a HUD just helps me identify whether an unknown is a regular or not - i.e. someone I don't have (mental) notes on already.. I don't typically use the specific stat/numbers that often in my decision making, but their stats will often make it pretty clear if the player is or isn't a reg, and that alone can help quite a lot.

Would be interesting if any regs disagree with me in general - obv feel free to post thoughts etc, but yeah if you any of you guys have any questions feel free to ask and I'll try my best to help

OMGClayDol,
I get what your saying because most decisions in MTT's is push fold but when I played the 90man KO's on Tilt I had a ton a hands on the regulars, like 10k+, and so a hud was very usefull.
Def helped me a ton. I had things like FCbet and fold to steal attempts, which really helped me when I was playing 16 tables.
Kidcharisma1

I use hands played to identify regs because I suck at remembering names.

Otherwise pretty much what OMG said, VPIP/PFR is useful for separating donks from tags. Notes are better than HUD stats in 90% of cases.

i used to have 3 rows of stats when i started SNGs but i found they hardly helped for the important last half of any SNG.

the only ones i find helpful are (especially at low/micro stakes where there are less regs therefore less stats):

name(hands)
VPIP / PFR / AFq / CPR

keeps it small and neat

100% agreed, since i started to review 10%-20% of my game after a session and go over each hand one by one and posting notes on villinas, scope the one i have over 200 hands tracked on to check what type of REG is, i have found that these notes are by far a lot more acurrate than any other stats HUD might show me about a villain tendency.

I only check HUD as a back up/complementary read system in case i dont have any note on that villain.

Yep...And when you get to the 500/1000 level read dependant decision are a lot more important than the one at the 10/20 hence the notes becomes a lot more important.

+1 to all the above

I don't use a HUD. You can be an excellent player without one, just use the notes feature.

yes and no. you are passing up an edge by not using a HUD, but sometimes I don't run hem because it lags my pc when I have too many things up (still +ev wo HUD, but prefer it obv)

I'm just starting out but I've found that basically the only things I look at are VPIP/PFR. And then for the most part just the three or four players to my left. I adjust my late position ranges quite alot based on how nitty or likely to call me off wide my opponents are. Basically I just use the stats to put players into LAG, LP, Nitty or TAG/Reggy. The specific numbers are, as has been said before here, never going to be much good especially as at the lower levels you should be moving up long before you get significant sample sizes on the other regs(so I am told at least).

+1

well done sir! keep it up, HUD helps here yeah.

a HUD is very useful for feeling out randoms when multitabling

Could someone point me towards a decent thread(s) to learn about stats etc would really like to reivew what i think i know about these

thanks

Huds are extremely usefull if you masstable, something which you should be trying to do when playing mttsngs.

My hud is:
hands / vpip /pfr
steal / f2steal / limpfold

hands because you want to know what sample you have

vpip and pfr because good players all have very similar stats (7-15 vpip and 6-14 pfrs, with vpip and pfr being at most 2 away from eachother)

steal because if you know this number you can play a perfect fold/call game. (obv need some sample for this)

fold to steal because if you know this number you can steal perfectly (again need to have played quite some hands with opponent(s))

limpfold because there are two kinds of limper: those who limpfold a lot and those who never limpfold. Very important that you know which type yours is. Not easy to get a sample on this, but if they limpfolded 3 out of 3 times you know they don't just do it with AA.

Thanks for this tip. Definitely see that this is useful, limpers are usually a big question mark for me. Only problem is getting enough of a sample to make the stat reliable I guess.

I play 180 man turbos and do not use a HUD. I have a couple of questions for those of you that do as I'm debating if I should get one or not.

I could see the value in a reg speed MTT but am wondering if they are as powerful and reliable for turbos as people think.

As an example I play very tight early on (as do lots of people) and then open up once the antes kick in. If you are using a hUD vs me and I start shoving are you giving me credit for being a nit pre-antes?

How does the HUD help when the tables are breaking and you're not at the same table very long with the same players?

Do HUDs show players life time winnings? Do you know right away who's a winner and who's a loser?

Am I costing myself money by not taking the time to learn to use one?

Thanks in advance.

I don't think it matters specifically for 180s but you should defo get a HUD imo!

You will build up your hands on the regs of course, which you will need to. But when the table breaks and you are vs new players, remember they know exactly the same about you as you do about them. It won't take long for you to build up a very rough profile on the player, particularly if they are loose (20-30 hands will give you a rough idea) and it's great when multi tabling and you don't get a chance to keep an eye on every player. I tend to assume that everyone is equal until I have a reason to think otherwise. You will spot a loose player much faster than a nit.

No. Your HUD stats come from the hand histories of the hands that you play. Whilst there are sites out there where you can buy hand histories from, they are against most sites policies

Absolutely yes. And myself included, most players don't use them to their full potential and probably display totally the wrong information too

Get HUD its worth the investment

Good info thx

depends on how many tables you're playing and how decent your comp is.
I don't use HUD as it lags when i 30+ table. Is worthwhile having for sure if that's not an issue.