What happen with good players who dont want to join because they think it's unethic and unfair?? They can't play hyper husng for a living anymore, right?
All this I remember to "The Goose That Laid the Golden Eggs" fables.

I don't play many hypers so the 'cartel' doesn't affect me. However poker is not like many things in life, often it is illogical so I can see that some fish can still join if they have friends who are good players. In poker world there are a few leach scumbags who suck the balls of good players just to try and get free lessons from them. In life most people naturally like to have people tell them how good and great they are and often because of ego they fail to see who is genuine and who is not. People who are not invited to cartel can just study hard and improve their game, like in connect 4 the $60 regs if study to maximum level will just end up drawing all the time. Obviously they share hand histories and have study groups on certain players, this is like the Isildur v Hastings etc when they shared the hand histories on a smaller scale.

How many members of the cartel are there and what were the origins and where is the list of who is in!

you appear emotional regarding this topic. that's exactly what sit declining is designed for, getting under the skin of the weaker regs from the cartel (obv you are not one of the weaker regs, just saying this can be applied to them).

note that i don't execute that strategy, i am merely trying to discuss all options someone has, who might as well be annoyed by the fact that a self proclaimed elite at his level decides who has the right to opensit and who doesn't. the discussion about effectiveness is not sufficient imo, there are some moral shortcomings of this form of association.

also lobbies should be distributed by evaluating skill, cartel just divides the group of regs into one category that gets lobbies and one that doesn't, while actually there should be a continous increase of lobbies with your skill level. if this could somehow be achieved (i.e. the weaker you are, the less you are allowed to opensit or the more you have to sit other regs), then every reg who wants to could be included into the group. maybe discussion into this direction has some merit.

Emotionx you aren't really in a position to make any comment. I've played you about 5 times over the last 2 years.

Sebouchhh I'm not ignoring it at all. I'm doing the opposite. I have no intention on being part of any of the cartels, but if people sit me simply because I am not part of a 'cartel' and they are being told to do so, then I have no respect for them. Sit declining them doesn't make any difference to the number of games I play/hour, as there are so many of you cartel fellows to sit.

And no avj, that is not true I am not in any cartels.

I find cartel list for $60, what is with the divisions? Is Division A better than Division D?
Division A:
Allingirl777
LEXA55
robertlauz
And9010
babavangftp
chrissXES
ggareth
Jazzzazz
koh1990

**** typing it all out, like 125 players in 60s alone, where is the origin for this? How long ago did it start and what do neutral people like myself think? I don't see it lasting, reminds me of George Orwell's 'Animal Farm'. Is the list here on 2+2 somewhere with more details? I don't see Chadders, Fishkfar, Mrgreen etc on list if they register for $300s will the people from 'Cartel 300' sit them?

About the discussion title of this topic, why don't just put nicknamed @ cartel so everyone can see these are not really cartels?

Also where are the lists of players in cartels (60s and 100s)?

Without names there's not much to discuss who should be in and out?

This is like fight club, the first rule of the cartel....don't mention the cartel? Some members are definitely not in on player ability. One earlier just open shoved first hand, I mean who even does that? Some players accept rematch in cartel, some have sat declined me, some accept when win decline when lose. Where do I find out more information? Are their official rules because two members are telling me bits and pieces but they are contradictory.

I guess SkaiWalkurrr and mrGR33N13 could play hypers for a living wirhout joining 60s cartel

All sit declining members will do is get you banned for life from ever being admitted. The best way to get in is to sit members be cordial and tell them straight up that u want a spot and are willing to play them until they agree to vote yes for your admittance, do this to enough members to ensure a +50% vote for u and u will get in.

There has been some lame stuff in poker over the years but this cartel BS is deffo up there with the lamest **** of all time.

Pirus, do you enjoy 30 people long waitlist lines? Anything beats that imo.

lmfao this is the biggest gay fest ever, who wants to be part of some 200+ membership to play online? I don't even play hypers but this cartel nonsense allows me to and to win for so many reasons I shall keep to myself. People upset with the cartel I wish I could share the leaks the cartel has but I cannot as I won't trust it not to become public knowledge.

What self respecting person would ever ask to join this immoral group. May allah curse you all 1000 times. It is a shame that pokerstars cannot enforce certain TandC through lack of proof or we would have 200+ players now either suspended or given warnings.

Play each other, so many pussays.

Ban Sharky - no more problems with cartels

Well, stake's best regs usually play other regs at their stake anyway, cartel or not. But there isn't enough of them to clear the lobbies.
Cartel just makes medium-tier regs play bumhunter regs, which doesn't happen much w/o cartel.

And anyway, being in wait line of 10 and sitting the weaker part of it still beats being in wait line of 30 and sitting the weaker part of it.

The only bad side of cartel is if a good player that also is putting in the volume, isn't getting in for some reason.

Btw, the 'ensure 50%+ yes vote' sounds much more reasonable than requirement for 75%(specially if you consider how many regs there are in lower level cartels).

Actually, once a group that protects lobbies already exists, it wouldn't make much of a difference whether sharky is allowed or not. It would just make it less convenient.

Well - it makes. Group cannot exist any longer without a sharky. How would you queue without this? Now you just turn on sharky (if Im wrong let me know - I dont use sharky so Im not 100% sure it works like I think it works) and wait for your game, you open sit faster than anyone without sharky, and you're not being sit by any other member of a group. How it is possible without sharky? Everyone have to play for themselves while registering manually. Simulsits all the time all other regs Weaker regs will be out of a business no matter if the are inside or outside of a cartel. Make 4 lobbies for higher stakes, ban sharky - should work imo.

Think logically, the format of pokerstars. The format of life. How is it possible to think that 100+ players team up per one stake can be good/acceptable/work long term. People are so short sighted. Any player who cannot sit in $60 game without joining a gang of over 100 other $60 players simply shouldn't be sitting 60s in the first place. Enjoy when pokerstars bring out the new ? lobby when you don't see who is registered and have to sit blind....o yeah you short sighted idiots you didn't know of this did you. I won't say no more on it, enjoy when it is implemented

Yeah, but in a few years they can tell their children that in good old 2014 they took part in a cool cartel group; it is all about ego! IMO a great chance for ambitious new players that do more focus on improving their game than to enjoy - short sighted - the benefits of a group.

O Division C of this cartel '24HourATM' timebank slowrolls with QQ in hu hyper preflop. The guy is a weak player and a scumbag, how can anyone have respect for a group of players which contains such pieces of ****. I am positive he was a small losing player during 2013. **** this cartel ******* clowns. Slow roll and keep licking *** holes. You think you can progress in poker this way?

Easy, regs wouldn't opensit much, and register to recreationals or people outside the group

Steps to getting into the groups:
1, don't cry on the forums and/or in chat
2, don't sit-decline
3, show willingness to fight
4, play well
5, show willingness to fight also after you get in
6, show willingness to improve your game


Yeah, probably it's bad for new players at the limit, or bumhunters, but if you're a hard working reg then it's gonna be good for you. Without acting hypers would die slowly due to the WLs getting longer, and longer.
It's a necessity... pretty strange, that most of the guys, who cry out their eyes in this, and the other thread are doing it w/o their SNs, or players who just doesn't deserve to be in, because they just wanna play recreationals and/or have big leaks, and don't wanna work on their game...

why is this discussion here? move please!

you can make a AHK script to sit coded players very likely or something similiar, it would just be inconvenient to opensit, buet nothing else.