I was referring to your post 'This is completely wrong thinking. Having chip lead or not should change 0 in your game.' and to nothing more. This had nothing to do with any particaular hand or particular opponent. What you said is just false and that is all, cause very often it should change a lot only because it affects villain strategy. Of course you need some reads to make some use of it, but still is is common among recreationals to change their strategy according to whether they have chip lead or not.

To Garlic yum - well, not you but this time it was Kombish. Previously other players - not very reputable.

You can look for Spamz over this forum - for some time he do not appear here. Dont know the reason. In the past he was pretty active user. Dont know what exactly were his games, but he wrote a lot about strategy and stuff.

you are wrong here, there def is difference between 3.5 and 30s recs

There is difference in the overall pool of course, but there are players that play 3.5s and tilted or whatever the reason play 30s, it's not like you never meet such. I am sure you see this type of recreational players higher where you play too.

pretorian_st - yes, to be completely correct I should have added "without reads"

Anyway was trying to add something useful, not to enter argument.

Any ideas how to exclude hands against particular players from a db search in PT4? Is it possible at all?

try adding in expression filter:
player.player_name != 'name'

Spamz was a legend in these forums.

I feel old

OP you c/r is fine based on villains frequencies.

I have completely destroyed (~7% ROI) all micro stakes for thousands of games recently and find all assumptions you made in the thread laughable. No offense.

If Spamz0r ever decides to quit video games and comes back (one time poker gods!) he would find your post amusing since games have changed tremendously.

For example if you follow his end game strategy today you are going to get deleted.

Might be - but - i remember reading this thread years ago to which pretorian refers and i tried to actually find it a couple months ago but couldnt anymore. I think he referring to the idea that 1 chip is not equal 1 chip and at certain points the more chips you have they are just a little bit more worth. And as far as i remember this wasnt pulled out of thin air but mathematically proven.

Well this might have been years ago, but the idea is still valid today as it has been shown in a recent and respected book. 1 chip isnt worth 1 chip under certain circumstances .

It would be nice to have more details on this. I think it makes sense though, because tournament isn't cash game. $1 = 1$ in cash games, but in tournaments since there are different prize pool then it makes sense that 1 tournament chip isn't always worth 1.

I not sure what you are referring to here... could you give me an example?


Spamz is GREAT! Ive been reading old post lately and Spamz was always there with great advice.

It has nothing to do with the prize pool (if you refer to 3player + games - its directly applicable for HUSNGs - and to find out i guess you have to look into Tiptons books.

If you keep doing that too frequent with those TP hands on such boards you
A) cost yourself a lot of value since villain is folding too much of his weak range you want to keep in.
B) it makes you incredibly easy to play. Think about this way.. whats more difficult to play against - a guy that c/r (a probably unbalanced) value range on flop or a guy who just flats and lets you barrel off.... In the first case you have a easy decision, in the second case you just hate your life from the first to the last hand

I don't have top pair here...

Im not sure if you are referring to this hand here, but we are looking to the most +EV move and not really the GTO. An exploitable strategy is what works best against those $3.5 players since they don't read board\range\hands very well and pretty much only play their cards.

I remember something that Ed Miller said in one video and it sticked to me. ''don't assume that villain plays and thinks like you do''. And that used to be a big leak i had at low stakes. I would put myself in villains shoes and ask myself '' what would i do if i were villain here'' and then act accordingly. But its the wrong approach because at these stakes, they don't think like i do...

I know you dont - but if you take this c/r line with total air you should have some value to do it with as well. Otherwise you are easily exploitable.

Yes i understand, its the micros, but if you ever want to escape them, think one step further not just how to exploit a micro player to the max, cuz frankly, this is never going to work at higher stakes. I see this line taken by guys in my games from time to time - and mostly its weaker guys and it just doesnt make any sense.

Now my point is, if you balance it out somewhat (which you should do), it depends on what degree.. If you play a lot of your TP hands like that, its not the most +EV line by far. So yes, you win EV in this very spot if you do it with total air but on the other hand, you cost yourself a bunch of EV with your actual value.

You need to think about your entire strategy, not just about one single spot. Because once you actually play vs. competent opponents, they will take you apart in those very spots and you dont even know whats happening to you.

Great advice, thanks. I'll keep it in my back pocket and pull it out once i face better players. So to be unexploitable here i should have some value hands like top pair in this spot? What would be a decent bluff to value ratio?

@gladiatoranc-hu hypers are effectively cash games where you cannot reload, there is no icm

therefore, think purely in terms of ev this hand

@callme-47s cr here fits very easily into balanced strategy, and its not as simple as you should balance a flop cr range, actually I believe your flop cr range should have more air in it than value, because you should be giving up on certain turn cards with air and not with value, and then your turn range should have less air than flop and more air than river, then on river you get to a situation where you have enough value for each bluff such that your opp call is indifferent based on your bet sizing, but u shud be bluffing quite often on flop in one way or another (including calling oop)

@callme concerning statement that cr all top pair is bad and exploitable- possibly you are right, but also possibly you are wrong<-- If you check raise all top pair, it doesnt make you necessarily exploitable, because it just means you shift the top of your check call range oop down, so it means that mid pair top kicker is always a call down, it also means that you opp theoretically widens his value and bluff range,therefore you theoretically call down much lighter and get to bluff cr way more countering his new bluffing frequency, balanced by your cr every top pair.

I think more important would be what is the best way to exploit average opponent in a vacuum- ie, cr j54 rb as much as possible with bluffs or only cr w value, then adjust your "other" range, so say you should be cr this as many bluffs as possible, then balance it by adding right amount of value, then once u do that, u have to shift your other ranges on turn and river based on ur flop ranges so that u will not be exploitable. But this could include check calling down K hi a lot and never having top pair in ur cc range

@fourchins
" it means that mid pair top kicker is always a call down" - that probably is the case even without capping your range by c/r'ing every TP+? even mid kicker would probably be a very standard call in case blanks come and a reasonable bluffing frequency from the opponent

" it also means that you opp theoretically widens his value and bluff range" - yep, if your range is capped villain can barrel much more for value, which allows him to have more bluffs

"therefore you theoretically call down much lighter" - nope, disagree here; f.e. you being capped after the flop can allow villain to jam river for value on middling second pairs.
If you already had a call on these...well, you still won't have a call on weak 3rd pairs, since increased value parts of villain range all beat you, and are balanced by increased bluff range. So call EV won't change for [most of] your bluffcatchers, you'll just get barreled off more frequently. Certainly don't agree that you can call down [much lighter] in this case.

I find listening to micro-grinders laughable as well - no offense.

We all know every micro-grinder want to taste real poker and makes thread like this where he makes deep analyse of thinking proces of random players at 3,5 - that is laughable as hell. Every micro-grinder thinks that he can explain moves of his opponents by attaching some logic to tchem, while most of those moves are completely random clicks based on human nature

+1

HUSNG are practically cash games not tournaments.

There is no bubble, no profit sharing, winner takes all. You can't use a "big stack" to your advantage so you don't need to think in terms of "You've the chip lead no need to become reckless".

Kobmish is right.


ROFL

I think you guys all have too much ego and your own agenda to even read other people's posts to jump to a quick conclusion as you see fit.

All of you are right in some way, and the specific point pretorian is making is not that important.

What's important is to not have your thoughts set in stone- i.e. there exists cases where you should care about chip lead in a huhyper (as pointed out by pretorian). Hell there are cases where you should make an immediate -ev play too but as long as you know how to think about these things properly and adjust to each opponent in any way that's seemingly possible then you are good to go.

Funny how micro-players are selfconfident Beating micros with 7% ROI is great achievement, congrats on beating random donks. You're my poker idol from now on. Funny that such guys always know everything best but somehow are still sitting at micros Best of luck in beating penny games.

^ fwiw he's playing 30s

And this thread sucks

Sent from my GT-I9505 using 2+2 Forums

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pls post your sharkscope and/or all-time ev-graph. i want to confirm your greatness.

Wow... He did get to 30's? Wow - respect dude. Now your life is probably completed and you can peacefully die. Somehow im not impressed. Let me know when you start playing 200+ games.