Villain is loose. He likes to pot every flop, he calls pf wide, but folded to all my 3bets. He plays overpairs just flatting pre and pushing over cbet, he also pushed busted draw otr when I checked to him. He opens 48%, cbets 80%.


SB: 1,625 (32.5 bb)
Hero (BB): 1,375 (27.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A J
SB raises to 100, Hero calls 50

Flop: (200) 6 5 K (2 players)
Hero checks, SB checks

Turn: (200) J (2 players)
Hero bets 125, SB raises to 250, Hero raises to 1,275 and is all-in...

My thoughts for raising this turn. Given his tendencies he cant have a strong value hand on this flop and check. He probably cbets this flop w FD. He certainly picked up some value ott but it's rarely a flush. His turn minraise looks to me more like a draw with naked diamond plus may be a pair. So I raise here for value - to get it in against his kind of hands, reasonable?

Note: Flatting pre is my std for this stack sizes.

the fact that he cbets 80%, but didnt cbet this flop, makes me think he is far more likely to have slowplayed a big hand than to have checked back air.

Your shove ott really makes no sense, u are getting owned when he has a value hand and are just folding out his bluffs. "Protecting" is a bad excuse for shoving. If you think he's full of it just call turn and c/call blank rivers.

So we just let him see the river for this minraise? We cant check-call on many rivers.

I'm sure he is not purely bluffing here, but what big hand could be slowplayed on flop like this? Remember, he shoved overpair (AA) - this is his idea of playing big hands. If he cbets 80%, he will def cbet FD on this flop. So I'm up against hand I decribed (draw + a pair, not K) or turned set / turned 2 pairs (both unlikely since I have a J).

i agree with zor, i wouldnt shove there either.

+1 zorzak. Also why didn't you 3bet pre??? It's not even like stacks are awkward for AJ (i.e. you'd have to 3bet fold vs a lot of ppl with AJ over like 50bb deep).

Also imo your hand ott was strong enough to be bluff catch (I believe he will delay cbet when you check almost 100% of the time), but can't really stand any heat, so I would have x/called turn.

3 bet pree !

Why we can't stand any heat here? What hands you put him on?

turn value bet is fine

3b/c pre WTF WE HAVE 27 BBS WITH AN ACE AND A JACK.

as played, call turn and fold if he fires again otr

It is probably fine- though tbh checking is also an option imo (unless full reads were given). Imo villain will delay cbet all his air/weak draws (maybe some of his showdown value for protection) and obviously valuebet all his strong holdings. You are also not getting 2 streets of value vs A high anyway.

It also depends on dynamic, which affects villain's range imo. Villain is opening <50% and cbetting 80%, but if you are xraising a ton, then value betting turn here is best as villain is gonna be checking back mostly showdown value. Don't wanna be results orientated but given we were raised, I sincerely doubt villain checked(checks) back showdown value (or in general), and is now turning that into a bluff- and this is the only thing we can use to determine his check back flop range in a vacuum apart from population tendencies...

As played his line is weird, but shoving ott is pretty bad. I could see him do this with QQ (that beats you) or some picked up equity ott. If you have been nitty to his flop cbets though, I would be slightly scared of him slowplaying some hand.

Ah... scrap that previous comment.

Valuebetting turn is best in general since before this hand we have no idea what type of holdings he is checking back otf. I tried to incorporate the hand itself into reasoning for the hand lol.

In general ppl are checking back sd value type hands and you can safely valuebet turn here.

need to 3bet this

I need to establish some strong calling range. I will get value because of his cbetting frequencies. Otherwise I will simply get him to fold - he folded to all my 3bets.

I dont think you played the hand well.
flop id 3b pre flop 27bb we can stack him off in 3b pot get value from his bottom calling range even if he fold few times i dont think he will fold lot of junk.
turn is close,c\c imo is better esp bcz he cbet 80% open 45%, you dont get value from a lot, myb better flop for betting turn KT5.

Your shove makes no sense,risk all your chips and get value from nothing fold out all value hands.

Ok, I get it. We fold cause we don't 3bet pre and we don't have the nuts.

im not sure u get it...

Noone cares about villain's hand range, so I make this 'conclusion'

"Your shove makes no sense,risk all your chips and get value from nothing fold out all value hands"

Based on what you think i wrote it if not villian hand range?

We don't see A5, A6 with Ad enough to make this shove worth it?

I dont think that players esp fish take line like min 3b on turn with A to base your shove decision on it.

3bet imo

Call turn raise and hope he keeps betting. Fold 4 flush rivers obv.

I think you definitely need to 3bet pre as said by many others - if his 3bet calling range is ridiculously tight surely he is 4bet shipping most hands you are getting dominated by - hence probably if he calls you are doing well against his range and if he folds then you win the pot. If he is folding a ridiculous amount then just expand your 3bet% til he adjusts to either peeling more or 4betting more.

If he starts peeling loads then depending on if he's playing fit/fold on flops or playing back loads adjust your range. If he starts peeling loads then expand your 3bet value range like QJ+. If he starts 4betting loads then expand to A9+ KJ+ 77's+ to call his 4bet shoves.

You can't have a fixed range for all opponents otherwise your going to be the one getting exploited.

As for the hand against villains that cbets 85% then definitely seems like he has a stronger range rather than a bluff. If you do think he has loads of Adx then flat turn and give up on the river. Since if he has the Ad, he can't assume you have loads of draws calling the turn and he'll give up the river. I think a fold is fine too but definitely not a raise.

Best to just start 3betting abusing the villain if he is folding to 3bets too much and opening too many hands and not 4bet shipping wider.

In general I think people take much more creative lines with value hands than bluffs fwiw.

In another world you flatted the turn raise and called his river bet and won a lot more chips.

Calling turn is fine, pushing looks like turning our hand into a bluff to me.

You were about to let him see the river for 125, now he paid 250 to do the same.