But thats the point Sherlock, the bot wouldnt do that. Its strategy would be static from the precomputed solutions. But if the bot had the capability of maximally exploiting based on opponen'ts tendencies, like a real time node lock, then obviously it would murder every one. But that was never the assumption. The assumption was that it was a bot that would play based on GTO solutions available to it

well hopefully you crush the games my dear watson

Even if you utilized ranges and tendencies of like 1m+ hands of the stake as an alias and it played a static strat based on those inputs I think it would do exceptionally well

Not sure I understand this. So let me try to explain what I've been saying.

Let's create a GTO bot. We will solve all the possible flops in Holdem for all the positions using GTO ranges or whatever preflop ranges you wanna use (cuz that doesn't matter much in the end so pick whatever preflop range you want).

Then whenever faced with a postflop decision, the bot will open up the presolved tree, nagivate to the required node, look at what the combo that he holds does and then act accordingly based on an RNG.

What Xenoblade claims is that such bot would beat 200z easily at 10bb/100+.

What I'm claiming is that this is not really true because such bot would make tons of mistakes versus real players if all it could do was copy and paste the strategy from those solved solutions because the solutions are a nash equillibrium postflop. Ingame players would be overfolding and underbluffing all over the place, making the copy/pasted GTO strategy not the highest EV strategy and potencially a worse strategy than the best regs at a given limit. You can't calculate how such bot would perform at 6m msnl and you can't assume it would crush.

The bot strategy would be static because it would always do the same thing vs any opponent when faced with the same decision. It can't adjust. And that's where we would perform much better than a bot. We are capable (or should be) of overfolding when someone doesnt bluff enough and overbluff when some doesnt call enough.

Now, if for some reason such bot can also adjust in real time, calculating the maximally exploitative strategy ingame when faced with the decision, knowing how its opponent is deviating from the equillibrium, then obviously it would murder every single player in the world. But I don't see how that would be possible with today's computers. But the first bot is way more conceivable.

Then I said that you can outperform the static bot by studying how to counter the imabalances in people's strategies by using node lock + MDA. Thats it.

Let's agree to disagree

Fine by me. Sorry for the long discussion OP!

i thought u were you just trolling but it turns out you really this delusional, and out of touch with the game, and obviously have no clue at the % of players winning at 5bb in todays game. Off the top of my head Id say its prob 5% at best out of the 200z pool?

I agree with Saulo. GTO is defensive in the sense you won't get exploited (if you apply it properly but most can't) but its not the highest ev solution, and it really does burn EV if you just blindly follow it in a vacuum. When Doug destroyed sauce in his HU challenge he said he basically just exploited the hell out of him.

so what, I'm the only one who thinks the games on stars got a lot softer since they removed rakeback?

They got softer for sure but not by that much that 5bb isn't a good wr. 5bb is still a very good wr, especially at 200z.

I don't really get why ppl moved from stars tbh, sure they cut rakeback but still the other sites that have good rakeback are really reg infested and your wr probably will go down a bit and the swings get much wilder.

what stakes u play if i may ask

5/10 and 3/6

Receipts?

My 2c would be on Xeno's side, as whilst Saulo is spot on about GTO not adapting to human tendencies (folding full range OTR vs a nut-only range, for example), cons like that are heavily outnumbered to the pro's, and I'm sure everyone can agree on that.

This isn't to imply that I think GTO outperforms all Human vs Human (specifically 200z in this case) WR's, though, as I believe guys like LLinus/OtB/Cindy (not saying Cindy is top 3, but his forte is exploiting imbalance) could come very close to, or even slightly best, a GTO WR.

However, that's just my 2c, and nothing can be proved for or against anyone's points, so we will have to just agree to disagree until OBORRA comes back . Just kidding, I OBORRA!

On a side note, and for the sake of giving credit where it is due, Mirage has completely hook, line and, sinkered some people into this with just a few words lol, wp sir

**** mirage hes a horrible little creature

allow him bro, he obv needs the attention in his life

---

Was in the mood for a big grind today! As I went to load the tables a window popped up saying that I couldn't play those limits; I forgot to ****ing remove the exclusion ban I set on Sunday, so that I could study on Monday+Tuesday without the temptation of playing. Alas, today was spent studying and doing a few irl things that I had been putting off doing for a bit.

Today has got me thinking about volume (on the tables) and the struggles I've faced with it, so I've decided to challenge myself and do a freeroll here to help me through it.

The challenge is simple: reach 45k hands by February 28th 11:59pm. Before anyone thinks that's a walk in the park, I'll give some further details:

Hands to go: 39,946
Hands/hr: 275-325 (this is for 2-tabling and is unlikely to change. If it does, my monthly target will not change to respect hours played)
Days to go: 15 (I'm still going to take Monday/Tuesday off to study, however I may play the odd session here and there to help the cause)

The above means that I've got 15 days to play 39,946 hands @ ~275-325 hands/hr, which equates to roughly ~8-9.5hrs per day.

The freeroll: $50 to 10 posters (not only the next 10 posts!!! Winners will be selected at random on video.) who post between this post and my next, which will be in ~24hrs. The freeroll will be void if I downswing >30bi's, or if there are major PS changes that in some way jeopardise my EV. It is also completely void to Meale/Mirage, cus **** em.

I really hope that this can spur me on to grinddddd, something that hasn't been long in too long!

Cheers & gooooood luck to me

Did Meale take your volume bet?


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i see free money, i comment, im a simple man.

here for free money

So little trust in your former coach

In for da freerollz

Here for the money.. not because I care about your success in any way Luke.

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why are your hands per hour so low for 2 tabling zoom? i averaged close to 500/hr

In 4 da freeroll.

Long time follower from battling in the 16z days, but you left me in the dust

glgl

I Also have low count / hour in zoom . Probs because i think a bit moar and play higher vpip than avg. Also i tend to watch some hand for intel after i fold

in and gl