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Old 01-18-2015, 12:27 PM   #8701
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by IbelieveinChipKelly View Post
Here are some stats from two rooms. Tell me if they mean anything to you

Room 1: 64 sessions. $7600 profit. 374 hours. A little over $20 per hour profit. 95 Percent of play at 1/3.

Room 2: 14 sessions. 92 hours. 3800 profit.
38/hr at all 1/2.

Lol sample size. But am I really better off at room 2?
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Maybe? Only way to find out is to play more really
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Old 01-18-2015, 12:31 PM   #8702
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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My standard deviation is around 1600 bucks an hour. I play live 10-25 plo.



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^This also seems very low to me
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Old 01-18-2015, 12:53 PM   #8703
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Chip, that 1-3 game has more nitty regs that nut peddle and play super tight than I have ever seen! It just sucks that it is the closest option for me now. It is the weirdest LLSNL game I have ever played in!
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Old 01-18-2015, 02:16 PM   #8704
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by JERRYJ0NES View Post
Ive been grinding on bovada 25nl, but I want to get into live poker. I live in tampa which is a decent poker town. I dont have 4k for 200nl (more like 1k) but one of my local room spreads a 1/1 NL 80$ max buy in. Do you think Id be better off grinding that til I get enough to shot take 200nl or just stay online for now til i get a proper live roll? Any advice would be helpful.
Depends on the rake. I am sure you can do well in the game but the rake may kill your winrate. 25 NL at Bovada may take a long time to grind up to what you want and being limited to only 4 tables will be frustrating. I would stick with unraked home games and Hard Rock has a 100NL game that is super easy to beat. GL
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Old 01-18-2015, 06:41 PM   #8705
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by Submerged View Post
Chip, that 1-3 game has more nitty regs that nut peddle and play super tight than I have ever seen! It just sucks that it is the closest option for me now. It is the weirdest LLSNL game I have ever played in!
i think you've been stuck in bad games and need to table change more. i had good games friday night; i played horrible saturday night and ran into quads on the one hand.

sitting at that table you were at saturday with seats 7, 8 and 9 is just not profitable.
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Old 01-18-2015, 07:04 PM   #8706
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

ONE TIME
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Old 01-18-2015, 07:09 PM   #8707
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Wrong thread
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Old 01-18-2015, 07:22 PM   #8708
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by IbelieveinChipKelly View Post
i think you've been stuck in bad games and need to table change more. i had good games friday night; i played horrible saturday night and ran into quads on the one hand.



sitting at that table you were at saturday with seats 7, 8 and 9 is just not profitable.

Yeah, hardly ever table change, you are right. I actually did later that night and it ended up alright. I will need to do it more if I keep going there vice driving the extra 30 mins.
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Old 01-25-2015, 12:40 PM   #8709
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^This also seems very low to me
It's 16x my wr. 30 percent of the sample was playing stakes lower than I play now so that prolly skews it I guess

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Old 01-25-2015, 02:50 PM   #8710
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Took a shot at the only 2/5 that runs once every 3-4 months and got crushed.

Game is softer then the 1-2 and I played like a fish, fak.
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Old 01-25-2015, 04:10 PM   #8711
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shortstacking confirmed not profitable live, must always buy in full to demonstrate ego and XXXX length to entire table... not possible to win short stacking- 2+2 says so, thus it is so

anyone who shortstack= bad- don't do it, save up until you can buy in full

repeat not possible to win shortstacking
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Old 01-25-2015, 04:45 PM   #8712
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by gus1112 View Post
shortstacking confirmed not profitable live, must always buy in full to demonstrate ego and XXXX length to entire table... not possible to win short stacking- 2+2 says so, thus it is so

anyone who shortstack= bad- don't do it, save up until you can buy in full

repeat not possible to win shortstacking
No one said it's not possible, just that it's not optimal, and stunts your growth if done exclusively.


Which is absolutely true.
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Old 01-25-2015, 04:58 PM   #8713
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Argument for short stacking is always related to BRM in one form or another.

Nobody in their right mind would knowingly play a weaker opponent with less money, if winning the most money is the sole objective.
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Old 01-25-2015, 11:55 PM   #8714
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Nobody in their right mind would knowingly play a weaker opponent with less money, if winning the most money is the sole objective.
100% truth.

Somewhat related; last night had a bit of a debate with idiot on my right that luck boxed his way to big stack. I was really deep as well. New guy (weak player) sits down and idiot gets upset because he thinks new guy has a little more than 300 cap. I asked idiot why he cared, don't you want the opportunity to win as much as possible with your big stack? He replies "rules are rules". New guy didn't have more than cap, just odd mix of red and whites.

At 1/2 or 1/3 where I'm very comfortable verses standard opponents , I always want to cover everyone at the table. I also constantly top up to max cap if I fall more than 50 below. Case in point, last night I dropped to 200 in 300 cap game in a tricky hand versus bad wanna be pro kid lag. I immediately topped up to 300, very next hand get it all in pre-flop with AA against same lag's AK. So I won a 600 pot instead of 400.




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Old 01-26-2015, 12:06 AM   #8715
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

The flip side to this is my bankroll strategy. I really draw quite heavily from Tommy Angelo with being a great quitter. In order to do that I really focus on a two buy in limit per session. If I fire two bullets and lose them I go home.

With the above in mind, I remember recently where I got crippled to 35bb with set over set on my first bullet. I nearly did as you said and topped up straight away. Instead though I opted to try and rebuild the short stack leaving my second bullet up my sleeve.

Luckily I did because 5 hands later had KK v AA and would have stacked off the second bullet too. Instead I lost the 35bb, bought in with second bullet and went home with 400bb 4 hours later...

Point is it can swing both ways at times I guess.

Cheers Luke

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Old 01-26-2015, 12:17 AM   #8716
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by lukeamac View Post
The flip side to this is my bankroll strategy. I really draw quite heavily from Tommy Angelo with being a great quitter. In order to do that I really focus on a two buy in limit per session. If I fire two bullets and lose them I go home.
That's why I wrote this earlier:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Parker View Post
Argument for short stacking is always related to BRM in one form or another.
----------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeamac View Post
With the above in mind, I remember recently where I got crippled to 35bb with set over set on my first bullet. I nearly did as you said and topped up straight away. Instead though I opted to try and rebuild the short stack leaving my second bullet up my sleeve.
That's the problem with stop-loss, you are essentially forced to play a less than optimal strategy because you cannot lose the BI.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeamac View Post
Luckily I did because 5 hands later had KK v AA and would have stacked off the second bullet too. Instead I lost the 35bb, bought in with second bullet and went home with 400bb 4 hours later...

Point is it can swing both ways at times I guess.
Truth is that it often swing the wrong way, but memory of that "one time" makes you think that it swings both ways.
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Old 01-26-2015, 12:20 AM   #8717
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That's why I wrote this earlier:



----------------------------



That's the problem with stop-loss, you are essentially forced to play a less than optimal strategy because you cannot lose the BI.



Truth is that it often swing the wrong way, but memory of that "one time" makes you think that it swings both ways.
Richard, you're probably right, except there is something to be said for my mindset when I'm in for just one buyin and even more so if I bring it back from the dead so to speak haha.

I feel like my mind and game is really good, strong and patient when I'm inside my stop loss. Look, works for me and that's all I can say.

Cheers Mac

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Old 01-26-2015, 02:08 AM   #8718
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

If I didn't have a stop loss I could blow through so much money in a single day. In fact, I've ignored my stop loss on a few occasions and blown through large amounts of money. The few times I've tried to buy in for the full $2k at 5/10 I've had absolutely miserable results. One time I blew $6k (3 buyins) in like 4 hours at a super soft table. When something like that happens I become depressed and won't want to play for like a week (or worse I will play with a terrible mindset).

My reasons for setting a stop loss are purely mindset (mental game) related. I have good days and I have really really bad days. It's hard to imagine anyone with a mental game as bad as mine to actually make a living playing this game, yet I've been able to do it successfully for over 3 years now. My mental game is 100x better than it once was but it's still terrible and a constant area of improvement for me.

BTW, b4 anyone comments on my SN there is a character restriction. It should be NeverLosesAtPokerWhenIPlayMyAGame
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Old 01-26-2015, 02:42 AM   #8719
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

nothing wrong with recognizing we are not perfect emotionless poker robots and adjusting our play around that

of course, optimal is to strive towards becoming a perfect emotionless poker robot, but that's really hard

I don't have a hard stop loss because that's dumb and like Richard says introduces that new problem where you're scared to lose and hit your stoploss. But I recognize that I tilt after losing a lot and I am prepared to leave if I catch myself playing like an idiot and the game isn't awesome.
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Old 01-26-2015, 02:52 AM   #8720
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

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Originally Posted by NeverLosesAtPoker View Post
If I didn't have a stop loss I could blow through so much money in a single day. In fact, I've ignored my stop loss on a few occasions and blown through large amounts of money. The few times I've tried to buy in for the full $2k at 5/10 I've had absolutely miserable results. One time I blew $6k (3 buyins) in like 4 hours at a super soft table. When something like that happens I become depressed and won't want to play for like a week (or worse I will play with a terrible mindset).

My reasons for setting a stop loss are purely mindset (mental game) related. I have good days and I have really really bad days. It's hard to imagine anyone with a mental game as bad as mine to actually make a living playing this game, yet I've been able to do it successfully for over 3 years now. My mental game is 100x better than it once was but it's still terrible and a constant area of improvement for me.

BTW, b4 anyone comments on my SN there is a character restriction. It should be NeverLosesAtPokerWhenIPlayMyAGame
I don't think anyone ever took your SN seriously. LOL. Hoped it was true, but as a reg I realize it is next to impossible to win more than 2/3-3/4 of your sessions.

As for SS and topping off, it is my new goal to never dip more than 25 percent below by original buyin. Last few sessions I've found myself very shortstacked a couple of times and not topped off. Almost cost me in a big way.

No more. Must maximize wins rather than minimize losses.
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Old 01-26-2015, 02:57 AM   #8721
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeamac View Post
Richard, you're probably right, except there is something to be said for my mindset when I'm in for just one buyin and even more so if I bring it back from the dead so to speak haha.

I feel like my mind and game is really good, strong and patient when I'm inside my stop loss. Look, works for me and that's all I can say.

Cheers Mac

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At least you know your CURRENT limitations but in order to EVER hit your potential as a poker player you should probably work on your mental game to where this limitation doesn't stunt your growth
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Old 01-26-2015, 03:09 AM   #8722
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At least you know your CURRENT limitations but in order to EVER hit your potential as a poker player you should probably work on your mental game to where this limitation doesn't stunt your growth
Of course, understand that, for now, this is how I best process the issue though and as time goes on I find myself being stronger and stronger.

Agree with your statement though.

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Old 01-26-2015, 03:10 AM   #8723
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oh I had been meaning to post this here, thought it was kind of interesting



someone on a different site said something to the effect of "i just go and play poker for six hours and i typically make $200", and I thought nah he doesn't know what he's talking about, there isn't really a typical session it's all over the place! I bet he's just some dunce who played five sessions and got lucky! So I sorted all my sessions by win and made a chart. Probably 60/40 2/5-1/2, several hundred sessions. Basically it's just a really thin line of each session in descending order -- long/flat means lots of sessions fall in that range, short/sharp means few sessions are. So if you take a 25% chunk horizontally it means 25% of my sessions fall in that range. As I thought, yeah there's no such thing as a "typical win". As expected it makes a pretty parabolic curve.

But you all knew that already.
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Old 01-28-2015, 02:54 AM   #8724
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re: Winrates, bankrolls, and finances

Quote:
Originally Posted by IbelieveinChipKelly View Post
I don't think anyone ever took your SN seriously. LOL. Hoped it was true, but as a reg I realize it is next to impossible to win more than 2/3-3/4 of your sessions.

As for SS and topping off, it is my new goal to never dip more than 25 percent below by original buyin. Last few sessions I've found myself very shortstacked a couple of times and not topped off. Almost cost me in a big way.

No more. Must maximize wins rather than minimize losses.
imo 25% is way too high, personally I go with 5% or less, just keep some big chips handy and break it up at the table if needed.. Obviously you need to be extra nitty about topping off when fun players have you covered.
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Old 01-28-2015, 04:59 AM   #8725
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Do you guys go after small edges (such as betting river light) as much as being anal about how much you are below max BI?
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