Based off of my experience in the 2/5 games at my local casino, it seems like there's either way less pre flop three betting than the average 2/5 game, or people way overstate how much 3 betting goes on. FWIW one of the regs lives in Vegas for the winter and Michigan otherwise and said there's at least twice as much 3 betting in Vegas. With that being said, there's definitely more 3 betting than the traditional 1/2 game.

Hand 1.
$800 effective, 9 handed. Unknown MAWG that just got moved to our table opens UTG $20 and it's folded around to another unknown MAWG who just got moved who 3 bets to $85 from SB. Hero looks down at A K in BB. Hero? Seems like a pretty gross spot.

Hand 2.
$1.2k effective, 9 handed. TAG who seems nitty, but also like he either plays for a living or makes a decent share of his income through nlhe opens +1 $25, LAG who seems like a winning player 3 bets +2 $100, and hero looks down at A K OTB. Hero?



Honestly, a few months ago I would've 4 bet these both without thinking about it too much, but I feel like I'm getting burned in these spots. Idk if it's just a bad run short run or what, but I feel like I've been marrying AK too often.

HH1...fold. People are very passive in general. When people have the confidance in their hand to get aggro (and they arent tough aggro player overall) just get out of the way. I will fold AK to one raise sometimes depending who it is, but this guy is 3 betting an EP open. His range is very strong.

HH2...either 4 bet or fold. I can make a case for either one depending on how often the TAG who opened in EP folds to 3 bets and whether or not the LAG knows him.

I haven’t played 2/5 in a while.

My initial thoughts:

1. Ya nasty. I don’t like any option. Interested to hear what others say. Kind of want to fold or flat. If OR 4 bets then easy fold. If it ends up HU with SB it’s not the worst spot ever. Still not super happy about any of it.

2. Seems much more like a straight forward 4 bet. Sometimes you run into the top of EP range but even a seemingly tight raiser is gonna have more in his range than KK+ and you’re more likely to end up HU in position with initiative against a Lag. And that’s how you make money against lags.

I would fold both hands and not mention it to anyone.

Obviously different if we're dealing with some late position ranges.

i am usually 4 betting in both spots.

In the games I'm used to, 4betting in these spots is marginal at best, and I would feel no shame in folding. I would never call.

Prefer to fold H1.

Agree with Mike that H2 is 4b or fold but I like having position and a big hand behind a Lag who is 3b a nit in relative position. We’re otb and the lag may think we’re raising light and call us down light.

both c4b, not close

I quietly fold in hand 1 though I can see an argument for flatting or raising, I think if you force me to play it I'm raising to $225.

Hand 2 looks like a dream spot to 4bet. LAGs need to be punished for their wide 3bet ranges. If we can't cold 4bet a LAG in nut position with AK, either we should move to a softer game or he's not a LAG at all.

Thank you for your responses, everyone. In response to HH2 - I'm concerned about 4 betting because I know LAG is aware of how tight EP opener is. If anything, I'd think HH1 makes more sense to 4 bet because we don't know if MAWG OPENING EP is tight or not, whereas with HH2 a nit is opening EP.

What’s the nits range though? Unless it’s like 3% or something crazy, I’m not worried about it because a cold 4bet is so strong that it should have massive fold equity.

You know your table though, if the nit snap flats TT, that’s different.

I would guess NIT's opening ~6% here. I agree, a cold 4 bet is super strong, and probably only gets looked up by QQ+. That's a really underrated point.

FWIW I fold QQ to a cold 4bet from most players and all unknowns when full stacked because if we face AK/QQ+ we’re in trouble anyway.