$1/$2, 9 handed.

Table seems to fluctuate from really loose to really tight and everywhere in between.

Hero MP2 ($350ish) - Attempting TAG. Have probably seen 5-7 flops in 2 hours. Not catching any cards worth calling. Taking a couple pots down with standard c bets on dry boards. Truthfully, playing with a major headache and somewhat frustrated at lack of cards when everyone seems to be intent on giving their money away to each other.

V1 BTN ($550ish) - late 20s/early 30s. seems tight and aggressive pre flop, but slightly more passive post flop . Sizable stack. From the way everyone treats him, he seems sort of a big deal. Won a seat for a Vegas tourney through the local casino, apparently, and finished second in points in a big regional tour. Probably is a thinking player.

V2 SB ($300ish) - 40s. in from out of town. Calls a lot, even with mid pair, sometimes worse. Have seen him call $25, $50 bets on later streets with not much. Catching some cards and doing fairly well for himself, and pushes when he's got big ones.

V3 BB ($60ish) - late 20s/early 30s. Idiot. Just busted out of the tournament and keeps buying in with short stacks. Has lost much of his latest stack taking it to the flop with TPTK only to be beaten by a flush. Has gone all in (with 40ish) with 7 9 . Spouts nonsense about pot odds and multi-way v. heads up but doesn't seem to actually play in a way that aligns with his talk. Wants to be a thinking player, clearly. Doesn't seem to be quite there.


A couple limpers to Hero in MP2. A Q . Hero raises to 12 Standard raise in the game, 4bb + 2 for limpers. I raise 12 almost every time I raise.

Folds to V1 who calls. V2 calls. V3 pushes all-in for roughly 60.

Limpers fold. Back to Hero for essentially 50 on top. I feel fairly confident that at least one of V1/V2 will call, particularly V1. I realize I have no theory on what hands constitute good hands for big multi-way pots. And I really am not sure about my 3! calling range. I honestly just don't run into it enough to where it forces me to think about it. I realize V3 is reckless. He obviously has a fairly wide range to shove with (as evidenced by his 97s shove earlier). Had he gone all in for 30 total, I call, no problem. But for some reason, the 50 on top intimidates me. I realize this may be a sign of faulty thinking somewhere. Also, he's seen me raise it up with 2 callers. I figure he must have something good because he has to assume we all have something worth playing.

Anyway, Hero folds and feels like a sissy nit. Both V1/V2 call.

What do you do here? Do you call with AQo? Do you fold? Do you 4 bet? I'm mostly interested in the why you do what you do. How strong is AQo multiway as opposed to heads up?

Thanks for all your input.

Pretty clear 4-bet to iso the spazzo. You don't want to take AQo OOP multiway in a protected pot. V1 and V2 shouldn't really be stronger than a mid pocket pair anyway.

Folding is way too nitty once you've seen V3 spazz before.

Too nitty OP. V1 & V2 would've likely 3bet with anything that beats you. lots of KQ A10 AJ 1010 99 88 77 66 55 44 in their range. V3 ironically described as the idiot ITT is the one who's aggression gets you to muck AQ against him. Funny how that works. But its ok OP, im currently getting bashed in my thread for 3 betting AQ against a villain who opens 30% of hands, so it seems theres no happy medium with that hand

Don't worry. The irony is not lost on me. I stand by my evaluation, hence why this particular hand sticks out as uniquely frustrating/troubling for me. (I also am not ruling out my own idiocy).

ive ruled out any idiocy you might have. My point was players can be so bad that they trick good ones into making mistakes due to their irratic play. OP im constantly trying to get help from people in these forums because leaks in my game have had me stuck at 2/5 for years on end. So far be it from me to imply anything negative about your play. Even the worst/spewy players can have it sometimes. Perhaps it was the right move. I personally don't like the fold but hey, ive gotten 30 responses in my recent thread about how bad I played AQ so don't sweat it!

Easy call heads up,against a bad short stack player, and an extra thought that his jam might've been anticipated

The last thing you want to do now is call. If you think you're behind V3, then fold. If not, you want to raise. Make it 180. You want to tell the other players, "OK pussies, go ahead and make my day. Call."

If the guy is shoving with 97s, then yeah, way too nitty. I would 4bet to $120 to ISO unless you have reason to believe someone behind you would be slow playing a big hand.

In these kinds of spots, I try and pick a number that makes my hand look super nutted.

4-bet to $145.

Sometimes even an OMC like me has to talk myself into "now I am finally in position to ISO against this fish, maybe he has two live cards and will win the race, and maybe I am behind something like jj+, but maybe this is the time to isolate with a big 4-bet and see if MHIG."

And then "pull the pin" and do it.

Most short stacks will shove light.

We might be domination KQ or QJ.

Sometimes a short stack like this will shove any two broadways.

Or worse!

If he has TT+, gg him.

I don't actually mind folding. it's prophylaxis at it's finest. If you raise you are now committing yourself if one of your opponents decided to flat predicting the short stack's raise. But you're getting 2:1 on your money with a likely 20% edge. Assuming the other two guys fold and this guy has 40% of hands you are making roughly $40 in EV. Even if he is only shoving top 20% of hands you are still making $35 or so by gambling against him.

But we can't quite assume the other two guys fold. Let's say 5% of the time they are trapping you. 19/20 times they fold and 5% of the time they get you for a 35% equity hit on 350. $100 in -EV. But that's such a rare possibility it's only really $-5 in EV on a hand by hand basis, so still worth the risk of gambling against the short stack.