Playing 1/2 last week and had a crazy sequence of hands. I need some help to tell me whether I'm fooling myself that I wasnt tilting.


Start with about $450

Dealt 77 in MP.
UTG (Villain1 - $150) calls, UTG+1 raises to $12, Hero calls $12, SB and BB call

Villain1 is a cocky younger guy, frequently tries to play about his ability, makes plays in bad situations, definitely tries to be "fancy". UTG+1 has a friend sweating him over his shoulder. He just sat down about one orbit before. No real reads, but he hasnt gotten out of line and he takes his time on decisions.

Flop 5 7 9
Villain1 checks, UTG+1 bets $20, Hero raises to $125 to go, folds to Villain1 who goes all in for $145 total, UTG+1 folds. Hero calls the $20 more

Turn K
River 9

UTG scoops with quad nines.

Hero is wearing headphones and hasnt been talking at all all night. No any reaction to hand, table makes several comments about set over set being brutal. Hero doesnt say anything.

Hero's stack is now ~$290

Very next hand, hero is dealt AA
Folds to Hero who opens to $18 looking to play the "I'm steaming" card. CO (Villain2 - covers) calls.

Villain2 is a thinking player. Above average in relation to the the 1/2 field. Not really passive but not really aggressive ABC player. Definitely the type who is capable of trying to take advantage of someone who might be tilting.

Flop 10 4 3
Hero leads for $25, Villain2 calls
Turn 8
Hero checks with intention to check raise, Villain2 bets $40, Hero raises to $140, CO tanks for ~2-3 minutes and calls.
River 6 (I'm pretty sure, I dont recall exactly, but is was a non flush card, essentially a blank.)
Hero shoves for ~135 more. Villain2 calls with a set of tens.

Hero rebuys for $100.

5 hands later, hero is dealt 22 in SB
UTG+ 2 (Villain3 - covers) calls, Hero and 4 others call

Villain3 is horrible. ATC guy who calls raises, floats a ton, and generally plays too many hands for too much money.

Flop j72
Hero bets $12
Flods to Villain3 who raises to ~110
Hero calls
Turn and river blanks.
MP scoops with a set of 7s.

This is really not a bad beat story. What I'm looking for is, was there anything I could have done, especially in the hand with AA, to play the hand differently. I feel like I played the hands pretty standard, and I'm am generally not someone who tilts (took years of effort to push myself to move on to the next hand and keep up my A game). But what could I have done differently in the AA and 22 hand? I feel like maybe I could have played either of those hands better.

Its just kind of a mindf***k situation and I want to see if I am being real with my evaluation that I played pretty standard in both of those hands.

W/ the aces, raise to $8 preflop. Bet $9 on the flop. Bet again on the turn, but fold to a raise. Or check/call turn. Goal is not get pot committed w/ such a weak hand as you did.

All hands standard, IMO. Brutal, but standard. I'm generally happy to get AA AI here with the raise size sets are unlikely.

you ran really really bad.
I don't think i lose set over set 3 times a year,
and i play all the time.
you lost set over set twice, and the AA hand is standard.
run better, imo.

is this a level?
AA;
weak hand?
you're kidding, right?

I don't know if I have ever said this before here but - standard.
You ran into 3 sets in a row, twice where you have your own and once with aces. The hand with aces could maybe have been played better, but the other two are automatic.

my experience is limited here, but are 1/2 really stacking off with one worse pair here often?

Hero put 6% of his stack in before the flop came. Then, after the flop, the whole rest of it, 94% went it. The other villain will not be putting in 94% w/out a hand that can beat one pair.

Hero should have not c/r on the turn. Instead, simply c/c. Then probably c/c the river again. This way:

Dude tighten up, stop playing 77 in raised pots. Those are going to the river. 77 does not play well to the river.

Second 22 lol fold that crap. Or live with the results. Especially chasing on a monotone flop. Like that's your fault your were crushed by a flush anyway.

The AA hand, you were oop. Tried to go for a c/r big mistake. Only do that with sets or better on the turn. If you bet and get raised on the turn you can fold AA.

Yes I said fold AA on a b/f. For who ever said AA is a big hand. You sound like the rest of the donkey's. Check it out, AA plays great preflop, well on the flop, once you get to the turn and river. AA not looking so well, they usually get cracked making moves with them OTT+ is -EV.

Thanks for the advice guys. Looking at it, I really dont like that C/R OTT with the aces. Should have just bet ~65 or so. In re the raise sizing PF, at that table, its got to be at least $12 (which is the standard open). An $8 PFR will get at least 3-4 callers. $18 was a little heavy, but like I said, I was going for the steaming dynamic. Looking back, I was probably just finding a rationale for my steamy betting... $12 may have been better, but I dont hate the $18.

I dont like a c/c line OTT with the aces, because he fires with basically his whole range when I check.

And Cali....
Yes 77 doesnt play well to the river, but I'm not looking to take it to the river. This was a raised pot, but its a standard raise, not a three bet pot. And the original raiser had me covered, so eff stacks are ~250BBs. Additionally, given table dynamics, its almost certainly going to the flop with at least 3, if not 4-5 players. If you dont set mine then, when do you?? I'm actually curious about your thoughts on that.

So, fold from the small blind for a $1 and then fold again after you flop a set, you get raised by a terribad player, the stack to pot ratio is <1 and I have ~40BBs. Sure.

I dont mean to defend my play that I was asking for advice about, but a) you werent really giving advice you're just flaming because you know the results and b) the only reason you posted what you posted is because I gave results. If I stop either of those hands at a mid hand decision point theres no way you say all that flamey ****.

Hero: 77
UTG limps, UTG+1 raises to $12 Hero calls, SB and BB call
Flop 5 7 9
Villain1 checks, UTG+1 bets $20, Hero...?

iLikeCaliDonks: "Should have folded PF! PPs dont play well to the river and this pot was raised to 6BBs. As played lol fold."

Yeah right...

Move to BBV. you ran bad, if you are well rolled this CRAP only cost you 3 BIs which is not that bad.you should have at least 10 to 15 more.

I'm not trying to be rude, but if you mean either of these statements seriously I very much think you are not good at poker.

If I call with a pocket pair it won't be 77 if he has anypair above your done. I call with 88+ but I like to reraise 77+ as well. I wouldn't setmine vs this player. Setmining is villain dependent. This cocky dude I'm reraising with 77+ but I won't do it UTG+2 I just toss it. So to answer your question fold pre.

If your going to call a pocket pair in the blinds nothing wrong with that. I actually like that play, but like I said live with the results. I call 22+ in the blinds maybe AK or AQ that's it. I toss everything else.

+1

Isn't flopping a set one of the biggest money makers in 1/2? LOL calling 77 with phenominal implied odds multiway is +ev if its to flop a set.

The 2 hands with a set are so standard its not even funny, expecially when its 75 BB risk or so.

I can understand why you played AA that way because of the "tilt" image you would portray but still... spewing a bit there. I would never C/R a turn unless its a LAG donk on a dry board. I like bet, C/C turn C/C river.

So calling with a dominated hand with players behind who are going to call is good poker?

No good poker is playing all the way in the back last to act, first raise in or defending your blinds. That's the way I play. That's good poker.

Setmining or making moves with the whole table left to act -EV. No other way around it, results or no results.

Isn't calling with a PP out of position LESS profitable in IP when villain has an overpair? I think your poker theory is off becauase stacking an overpair in 1/2 with a set is probably the biggest moneymaker when the two hands meet in NLH

If calling for set value is not +ev with multiway flops, especially with 44-77 range, you are playing a ****** game

He is oop as well. But if I'm going to defend the blinds in LLSNL it will be a pp or setmine from lp as well. I don't see the leak your talking bout so enlighten me. I'm here to better my game not meet enemies. I listen to everyones advice if its solid. Find the leak please thanks.

What's the percentage you get a pp in the blinds? Or pp in LP? I'm pretty sure its low, I play most of my speculative hands in position or a meh call. When I say position I don't mean hope position I mean last to act.

I apologize if I seemed to come across rude there; I just think 77 as OP was speaking of is a profitable call all day 3 ways in hopes to flop a set. In OP's scenario it was a limp and a raise from cocky player. If you call, UTG will call and this will enourage others to call which is what you want out of 77; great odds and then flop a set. Who cares if a player has AA preflop, if you miss you dump it.

Then playing small PP HU out of position in the blinds is -ev especially against a villain not on button. You loose the most money in the SB and BB even if you fold everything but premiums; therefore defending HU with small PP is a leak for sure in my opinion.

I'm sorry it just sounded like you were advocating playing small PP out of pos in the blinds specifically and ignoring great odds of calling to snap someone off.

and also, your 77 is IP vs. the raiser anyways which is important to note. if others flat behind you, thats fine they arent even the agressor. You are only proceeding if you flop a set anyways if there is more than 3 in there. Plus if you flop a set you are almost always ahead anyways

Knowone said anything about headup calling in that spot is -EV, sorry If you took it wrong. I know your a good player you knowone in poker calls headup from the blinds with a small pp from an ep raiser. C'mon man I know you trying to give me the needle which I have no problem taking it. But when someone questions my poker skills I question there's.


Calling behind an UTG raiser setmining is not a play I look to make. Even with 77 its hard to play your set oop.

For the person that said sets are the biggest money makers your wrong. Its straights and flushes which are the big PP crackers. Even then you have less then 17% equity.

This is just painful to read. Again I'm not trying to be condescending in the least, I'm actually trying to help, but this kind of absolutist attitude towards these sorts of hands and spots is completely detrimental and makes for advice that is frankly poisonous. If you are serious about poker you would do well to abandon that mindset altogether and look at your play from a more objective point of view.

And yes, calling with a dominated hand with players behind who are going to call is quite often very good poker. They're called "speculative hands" for a reason, and it's not because they're not often dominated preflop. That's actually their strength. Not understanding this shows some very fundamental leaks not just in the specifics of your game, but in your entire poker philosophy.

Quite obviously multiway pots are the best sorts of pots to play with those hands. DUCY?

I don't know what to tell you, man. You seem utterly set in your ways and are completely wrong. I think you need to read some poker books, approach their advice with an open mind, see why they give the advice that they give, and shy away from absolutist statements regarding certain hands or positions. Poker is a fluid game and no two spots are ever exactly alike. Instead of sticking to simple maxims like the ones you're spouting in this and other threads, try to understand the philosophy behind those maxims, work on what the exceptions might be, and don't assume that just because you don't like certain hands in certain spots means that playing them in a way different than what you dictate is bad poker, full stop.

You don't know me from Adam, for all you know I'm a complete donk with a 75 IQ and completely hair-brained ideas about the game, and I do understand how rude it is for someone to barge into a thread that's not even your own and try to tell you that your entire poker philosophy is built on an unsteady foundation, but there you have it.

To the OP: the first and third hands are coolers, pure and simple, don't look back. The aces you can definitely get away from, and I don't like how you played the hand. I bet the turn, looking for a CR is FPS-ey, and if villain bombs out with a raise I think that's where you can dump it. I'm looking to get 3 streets of value in your spot but not looking to play for stacks.

AA is not a weak hand by any stretch, don't treat it as such, and don't listen to the peanut gallery, but also don't get married to it unimproved in deep spots, particularly with high flop SPR's and where you are not the aggressor.

low to mid pairs are the biggest moneymaker in 1/2 NL. Just look that stacks are deep enough. 10x raise size minimum. 15x is better. Especially important is raisers stack size.

I just laugh all the way to the bank at people who fold in these spots. Ex: stacks effective $250 early raiser goes to $12 and one call? I call with 22+ every time. to not call in this spot is to lose money. Actually I LIKE the pair to be smaller. Easier to get away from .. if you have 88 and the flop is 237 its too easy to think you should call or make a move. LIttle pairs == all upside and the only downside is someone flopping a bigger set. If its set over set, I will stack off and say "oh well", because it is so rare.

This is assuming its your typical 1/2NL table and there isn't much 3 betting of course.

Wait a sec, wouldnt a PP be better than getting a straight and flush because it is concealed?? If the flop is 10 7 2 rainbow isnt it hard to put us on a hand? A flush you are usually drawing on flop and putting in money while behind. Plus people in 1/2 with overpairs bet the pot anyways so you wouldnt have odds to hit your hand. With a set you are concealed and the average donk will pay you off no matter what with the logic of "well i have a pair higher than this point, im not folding."

also with a small PP we WANT our opponent to have an overpair! don't we want to call an UTG raiser because his range is so narrow? Then when we beam the set with odds its stacks! =)

Wow all I'm going to say is keep setmining. I know as well as you guys know. Only sorry players setmining I stop doing that like years ago. Only noobs and old farts setmine.

But we will agree to disagree. Setmining is meh at best.