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Which of these hands we call/raise with from BB Which of these hands we call/raise with from BB

01-20-2013 , 07:29 PM
Lets say its a new table and everyone has 100BB. You are in BB. UTG opens to $12 and 4 people call.

Call?:

A. 78 suited
B. KJ suited
C. 22
D. AJ off suit

Raise?:

A. 1010
B. AK suited
C. AK off suit
D. JJ
01-21-2013 , 01:59 AM
Obviously it depends a lot on table dynamics and stack sizes as well as the ppfraiser's range in that spot. Also implied odds. I wouldn't raise any of those hands OOP without reads, there are just better spots to be had later in the game. That being said, flat AK and the pocket pairs and fold everything else until you get reads, then start playing real poker.
01-21-2013 , 03:06 AM
In general with no reads:

A. 78 suited - FOLD
B. KJ suited - FOLD
C. 22 - CALL or FOLD (I like to call)
D. AJ off suit - FOLD (this is by far the worst to call with)

A. 1010 - RAISE or CALL
B. AK suited - RAISE
C. AK off suit - RAISE
D. JJ - RAISE or CALL
01-21-2013 , 03:12 AM
U should be playing super tight here. I'd flat all pocket pairs jj and under and AQ+. 3bet with qq+ only and fold qq to 4bet from original raiser. Obviously as u develop reads ur range can change a lot but sticking to this guidelines u will never make a big mistake
01-21-2013 , 03:14 AM
Also, it depends on your image. If you have a tight image then you can obv raise here with a wider range and if you have a loose image then donks will call you with a wider range.
01-21-2013 , 03:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timber63401
Lets say its a new table and everyone has 100BB. You are in BB. UTG opens to $12 and 4 people call.

Call?:

A. 78 suited
B. KJ suited
C. 22
D. AJ off suit

Raise?:

A. 1010
B. AK suited
C. AK off suit
D. JJ
Grunch

I'm calling with C. I'd hate to play KJ out of position, and maybe I'm a nit but I'd probably fold that. I'd definitely fold the other hands.

I'm raising with B and C, and I'm not sure about D. With pocket queens I'm definitely raising.
01-21-2013 , 04:43 AM
78ss fold
KJss fold/call
22 call
AJo fold

TT call
AKss raise
AKo raise
JJ call/raise
01-21-2013 , 04:52 AM
if UTG is a somewhat loose opener, i´d 3bet squeeze almost all of them
01-21-2013 , 01:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sauhund
if UTG is a somewhat loose opener, i´d 3bet squeeze almost all of them
New table; have no info on UTG.

Better to play tight early which will lead to more profitable options later in session.
01-21-2013 , 02:34 PM
This entire premise is faulty. It depends on UTG, what the rest of te table does ahead of you, and your image.

In subset a the only hand I'd even consider calling is 22 and conditions must be right.

Subset b is wholly dependent on the above conditions mentioned. Unanswerable as stated here.
01-21-2013 , 03:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timber63401
Lets say its a new table and everyone has 100BB. You are in BB. UTG opens to $12 and 4 people call.

Call?:

A. 78 suited
B. KJ suited
C. 22
D. AJ off suit

Raise?:

A. 1010
B. AK suited
C. AK off suit
D. JJ
Without more info or having reads on any of the players:

Section 1 - A/B/D fold, C call and c/f if not flopping a set obviously

Section 2 - A and D, call hoping to flop a set, re-evaluating if not and flop comes with low cards. B and C I am probably raising to $75 and shoving any flop if someone calls.
01-21-2013 , 05:54 PM
I'm folding AJo.

Every other hand I'm playing, mostly by calling. I'd consider 3betting the AK hands. If opener was really loose (remember, he's in EP), I'd consider perhaps 3betting JJ/TT, but usually just calling and almost setmining here.

Gpassivecallingstation,justlikeallthegoodpokerbook srecommendG
01-21-2013 , 06:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timber63401
Lets say its a new table and everyone has 100BB. You are in BB. UTG opens to $12 and 4 people call.

Call?:

A. 78 suited
B. KJ suited
C. 22
D. AJ off suit

Raise?:

A. 1010
B. AK suited
C. AK off suit
D. JJ
I am only calling with 22 there. I play JJ and 1010 here the same way, with no reads.

As for raising, I raise with AKs and AKo there, to 55.
01-21-2013 , 06:17 PM
First hand completely read less I'd call all but AJo. Probably call KJs, 87s and 22 but folding those are fine too.
01-21-2013 , 07:27 PM
I call with the 22, and the KJs....If i hit a K or J top pair, I bet out and know exactly where I'm at (that the advantage to multi way pots even without reads)...

I shove AK and AKs...Call TT and call or 3 bet JJ.....(AK likes to see 5 cards, and its the hand players put you on and if you get called to any 3 bet you have to shove it on any flop with the spr)....
01-21-2013 , 07:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_blue
I call with the 22, and the KJs....If i hit a K or J top pair, I bet out and know exactly where I'm at (that the advantage to multi way pots even without reads)...

I shove AK and AKs...Call TT and call or 3 bet JJ.....(AK likes to see 5 cards, and its the hand players put you on and if you get called to any 3 bet you have to shove it on any flop with the spr)....
I think shoving AK is not optimal since it will only get called by QQ+, but if you raise to $60-80 and shove any flop you may get a call/fold flop if someone has a PP or a hand like AQ.
01-22-2013 , 01:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_blue
I call with the 22, and the KJs....If i hit a K or J top pair, I bet out and know exactly where I'm at
Thats not really true. Unless the board is hyper dry, AJ will just flat on the flop and you'll end up value owning yourself. I don't know what game you play in, but most LLSNL players do not reraise with just top pair. I'd play it in position though, but you can just fold that on a new table OOP and wait 10 minutes until you have a clue what the people in the hand play like.
01-22-2013 , 01:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timber63401
Lets say its a new table and everyone has 100BB. You are in BB. UTG opens to $12 and 4 people call.

Call?:

A. 78 suited
B. KJ suited
C. 22
D. AJ off suit

Raise?:

A. 1010
B. AK suited
C. AK off suit
D. JJ
Villain/table/situation dependant, and of course as always in poker its not a clear answer, but here goes my "typical" line:

A. FOLD
B. FOLD 99% of time
C. Call usually, fold occasionally
D. SNAP fold

A. Call most, 3b occasionally. 3b only if player opens liberally and is not positionally aware.
B. 3ball very often, shove just about any flop if HU. Call only against a nit.
C. Same as B
D. Same as A, but 3bet a bit more often.

Oh and by the way, when we 3bet, it almost certainly has to be a 3bet/call off with 100bb or less (even like 110-115bb) because any 3bet here is going to have to be $65+ with all dead money. Plus AK has blockers to KK and AA, so chalk that up as poor variance if you are crushed even to a 4bet pre.

Last edited by Pay4Myschool; 01-22-2013 at 02:12 AM.
01-22-2013 , 01:55 AM
I think the best discussion here would be how we play AQo and AQss preflop here. Very sticky spot where I believe we get a mixed bag of fold, 3b, and call pre.
01-22-2013 , 02:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pay4Myschool
I think the best discussion here would be how we play AQo and AQss preflop here. Very sticky spot where I believe we get a mixed bag of fold, 3b, and call pre.
I personally would fold AQo here and call with AQs. Don't know if that's right tho. I'm never 3betting in this spot with either hand without reads.
01-22-2013 , 12:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little_blue
and the KJs....If i hit a K or J top pair, I bet out and know exactly where I'm at
I didn't play KJs to hit a drawless TP OOP in a very multiway raised pot. I'm check/folding the majority of the time, unless it's liked checked around to an aggy LP player who might be taking a stab.
01-22-2013 , 05:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spikeraw22
This entire premise is faulty. It depends on UTG, what the rest of te table does ahead of you, and your image.

In subset a the only hand I'd even consider calling is 22 and conditions must be right.

Subset b is wholly dependent on the above conditions mentioned. Unanswerable as stated here.
Which is why I'm locking this. I'll add that even at a brand new table with no hands dealt, you should have more reads on the villain than you've given. A 65 year old with a cup of coffee in front of him at 10 am Tuesday morning is different than a 22 year old at 4 am who's been drinking all night.
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