2-3 NL usually plays like a 3-5

V1 (2k) : MABG. Loves to chase, bluffs a little bit doesn’t get out of line often.
V2 (2300) : YWG. Brash cocky kid who bluffs some but has it in big pots. Plays way too many hands pre, and passively

Hero on btn with T8dd

Utg (800) raise to 15, V2 calls in Hj, hero calls, V1 calls in sb. 4 ways

Flop (63) : Jx9d7d
V1 checks, utg 20, V2 60, hero 200. V1 snap cold calls, utg folds, V2 calls

Turn (683) : 8x
V1 checks, V2 bets 400

He has like 1700 back. I don’t have a lot of sessions (3-4) with him. I don’t think he raises flop with QT but this is quite a bet on turn for just Tx no redraw. Also V1 can easily have QT. Then again I’m free rolling Tx and forcing V1 out is a big win. Not sure what’s best

Call, your too deep to gii

H has a straight FD, right?

If we just call, V1 almost has direct odds to call his FDs and certainly the proper IO. V2 should be over-betting his QT on a board wherein the nuts can change easily on the river. So I think he has a lot of two pair here (97s/98/J8), but he can certainly have some JT.

So I'm jamming it in here hoping V2 has JT and we free-roll. I'm happy to fold out V1 because I think the action has compressed him to NFD or something like KQs looking for gutshot. V1 as described likes to chase, so I want to give him a bad price to chase. I don't care about folding the lower part of V2's range (two pair hands). There's 1000 American in the pot and it's not a bad result to take it down here without river drama.

Flop: There is so much to get value from. Straight draws, flush draws and we unblock all the 2prs + sets. I like a 4.5x+ raise on this texture with the nuts and redraw.
Turn: V2 is most likely to have JT, QT or KT, not a set or 2pr. I don't see what else he could have to lead turn on 4 to a straight board into 2 other PPL. V1 seems like Jx dd or NFD. I like raising all in to put max pressure on JT or KT to fold a chop and price out higher FDs. Might even be freerolling him if he calls without QT. If we happen to run into QT we at least have the flush outs to fall back on.

He's not allowed to bet that much without the Td even the rare times he has QT. It's absolutely a shove for this reason + plenty of equity vs QT + near-freeroll vs Tx + equity edge against anything <Tx + you 3b flop + you actually have it +beat the cocky kid equity. You're too deep NOT to shove.

I think I just gii now. Too many bad cards for us and them on the turn. Hard to see his raising QT on the flop.

My thoughts exactly. Did he really look down a QT w/out the Td and decide "I'm gonna start an elaborate multi-way, multi street bluff on this sopping wet board. I raise to.....60!"?

Not saying it can't happen, but it sure seems unlikely.

Its not that big of a stretch for him to raise QT, utg bets 1/3 on a ridiculously wet board, it just screams weakness.

I guess im the only one taking the cautious route. The ev difference between shoving and calling shouldn’t be that huge anyway.

If V2 has equal amounts of JT, KT and QT then our equity heads-up is around 45%. It’s a fine spot to shove, because there are benefits to cleaning up our equity versus V1 with his likely set or NFD or Jxdd…but I don’t think it’s a fist-pump spot.

All you can eat. Not even a full PSB.

Misread and thought everyone had 2k or more I don’t think you can really mess this up. Calling keeps his range wider but jamming is a min raise so

I thought it was implied that Hero covers V2, so everyone has >2k, which makes a jam on turn quite large (more than PSB, much more than a min-raise). But I see hero’s stack size is actually not specified.

Where did you read that jamming is a min raise?

Hero covers yes. It’s basically a pot sized shove on turn