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Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies?

09-14-2011 , 09:31 PM
I've been playing a lot live and having a hard time of keeping track of player's preflop tendencies other than the extremes. (miss my HUD :/ RIP)

If someone is super aggro I can tell that their range is wide, and if they're tight I can tell they have a narrow range but outside of that I have a hard time determining other people's vpip/pfr.

Any thoughts?
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-14-2011 , 10:37 PM
Get them to wear a Mike Caro Auto-HUD around their neck if they will.

If they wont, then jot down notes on your phone for players you see often. Keep tabs on them. Refer and add to notes.

Players u see on sparse basis you must simply remember at the table what u can. Just pay attention and attention to remembering for the day.
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-15-2011 , 03:19 AM
here is what I do - i take my $1 chips and make 3 piles - a) fold b) call / limp and c) raise / 3-bet to track villains VPIP. After every pre flop action I add a chip to the pile. after a few orbits i have a good idea of VPIP and that helps me a lot with villain's range. You can only do this for one player at a time, so pick an active player or a regular you are likely to see again. It's also good to help keep me focused on the hands I fold.
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-15-2011 , 03:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheClubber
here is what I do - i take my $1 chips and make 3 piles - a) fold b) call / limp and c) raise / 3-bet to track villains VPIP. After every pre flop action I add a chip to the pile. after a few orbits i have a good idea of VPIP and that helps me a lot with villain's range. You can only do this for one player at a time, so pick an active player or a regular you are likely to see again. It's also good to help keep me focused on the hands I fold.
Like...really?

What I try to do is to predict before the player is to act what he's going to do. It helps to focus on the game while you're not in the hand and you'll get a feel for the others basic attitude. I don't tend to trust on tells all that much, but you'd be amazed on how some people deviate from their basic attitude and basicly play their hand face up. Try it, after a few orbits you'll be like "ok four eyes will call ofcourse, fatso will limp along, asian dude will fold as usual,..." Then next time you go to the cardroom you'll be like ooooh fatso calling station is on that table, might wanna sit there...
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-15-2011 , 03:35 AM
This doesn't mean I don't pay attention to other action, but it's good to have some actual data to go with my observations and to know that I'm doing something on every hand, not just the ones that stand out
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-15-2011 , 03:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheClubber
here is what I do - i take my $1 chips and make 3 piles - a) fold b) call / limp and c) raise / 3-bet to track villains VPIP. After every pre flop action I add a chip to the pile. after a few orbits i have a good idea of VPIP and that helps me a lot with villain's range. You can only do this for one player at a time, so pick an active player or a regular you are likely to see again. It's also good to help keep me focused on the hands I fold.
I do this, too. But if the buy-in is good (2/5 - 500max) you can buy in for all $1 chips and keep all stats on all players at the table.

Ex: I start off the night asking for 5 racks of low-society. I empty the racks, and keep the empty racks on my right side. The first 2 empty racks (with 10 slots) are for VPIP/PFR. Every time a player enters a pot, they get a chip in their respect rack slot in the front. If they are PFR, they get one in front, and one in back. This way, in play, I can quickly look at the difference to see how passive or aggressive they are pre-flop.

The next 2 racks are for cbet (in the front), and fold to c-bet (in the back).

The last rack is for 3bet/fold to 3bet. I usually only need 5 slots because so few people 3 bet.

Of course, all of this prevents me from actually putting my chips in the pot so when it's my turn to bet or call, I just announce the number and write it down. If I lose, I have to give up all of my data (or rebuy)... if I win though, it's all good.

People get upset at me for taking up so much room at the table, but I just tell them they're mad because I'm a better player...





Spoiler:
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-15-2011 , 05:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by donkey xote
I do this, too. But if the buy-in is good (2/5 - 500max) you can buy in for all $1 chips and keep all stats on all players at the table.

Ex: I start off the night asking for 5 racks of low-society. I empty the racks, and keep the empty racks on my right side. The first 2 empty racks (with 10 slots) are for VPIP/PFR. Every time a player enters a pot, they get a chip in their respect rack slot in the front. If they are PFR, they get one in front, and one in back. This way, in play, I can quickly look at the difference to see how passive or aggressive they are pre-flop.

The next 2 racks are for cbet (in the front), and fold to c-bet (in the back).

The last rack is for 3bet/fold to 3bet. I usually only need 5 slots because so few people 3 bet.

Of course, all of this prevents me from actually putting my chips in the pot so when it's my turn to bet or call, I just announce the number and write it down. If I lose, I have to give up all of my data (or rebuy)... if I win though, it's all good.

People get upset at me for taking up so much room at the table, but I just tell them they're mad because I'm a better player...





Spoiler:
lol
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-15-2011 , 05:35 AM
In all seriousness OP, if you can't do this kind of thing through observation and memory, live poker will be a struggle for you.
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-15-2011 , 06:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by donkey xote
I do this, too. But if the buy-in is good (2/5 - 500max) you can buy in for all $1 chips and keep all stats on all players at the table.

Ex: I start off the night asking for 5 racks of low-society. I empty the racks, and keep the empty racks on my right side. The first 2 empty racks (with 10 slots) are for VPIP/PFR. Every time a player enters a pot, they get a chip in their respect rack slot in the front. If they are PFR, they get one in front, and one in back. This way, in play, I can quickly look at the difference to see how passive or aggressive they are pre-flop.

The next 2 racks are for cbet (in the front), and fold to c-bet (in the back).

The last rack is for 3bet/fold to 3bet. I usually only need 5 slots because so few people 3 bet.

Of course, all of this prevents me from actually putting my chips in the pot so when it's my turn to bet or call, I just announce the number and write it down. If I lose, I have to give up all of my data (or rebuy)... if I win though, it's all good.

People get upset at me for taking up so much room at the table, but I just tell them they're mad because I'm a better player...\
I would give you a black chip if you pulled this off at my table. It would be money well spent.
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote
09-15-2011 , 11:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by quesuerte
In all seriousness OP, if you can't do this kind of thing through observation and memory, live poker will be a struggle for you.
I kind of agree with this. HUDs were a way of using existing data to quantify player tendencies from which we could make assumptions in the online world where we are often playing multiple tables and have only a screen name or avatar to associate with our mental database.

While I agree hard data would allow us to make some more mathmatically based decisions, live poker offers the opportunity to allow our brain to absorb much more information we don't have available when multitabling on-line. You need to allow you mind to work a little differently and trust it. You will be able to construct reasonable hand ranges without actually counting pots entered etc.

If you really feel strongly about this though someone mentioned an iPhone app that I looked up. Might have been called donk tracker or something. Looked like a ripoff but basically you tallied player calls and raises bytapping the screen and it calculated PFR and VPIP stats

edit/ here it is http://www.donkeytest.com/donkey_tracker.html

IMO it is wrong headed though.
Strategies for keeping track of pf tendencies? Quote

      
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