Local Casino $3/5

Villain 1 ($~400) in SB: competent TAG reg. Shows down goods.
Villain 2 ($~400) in MP3: Maniac ATC.
Hero ($~900) in CO: Viewed competent and manic is avoiding getting in pots w/ hero.

Table Dynamic:
Action has been crazy due to a semi-big tournament going on. Lot of $1000+ pots where it was hard to see even 3~5 in a session. Villain 1 moved tables about 1 orbit ago. Villain 2 is living up to his crazy image. Hero has bought in for $300 and doubled up recently.

All folds. Villain 2 limps. Hero limps w/ 9h7c. Button folds. Villain 1 raises to $30. Villain 2 calls. Hero calls.

Flop: (~$90) Jh Tc 8d

Villain 1 checks. Villain 2 checks. Hero bets $70. Villain 1 raises to $170. Villain 2 folds. Hero re-raises all in. Villain tanks. As he tanks, his face turns red.

Hero rolls over 97 and says, "I know you have a set of jacks. I don't want you to draw out on me, but if you want to gamble, I'll gamble with ya."

Thoughts?

Grow some balls, keep your mouth shut and hope he calls with his one in 3 shot! He might even have a lot less like an overpair!

good bluff

Thoughts? You have the second nuts and he didn't snap call so you have him beat.. telling him your hand gives him the chance to play perfectly with pot odds of around 1.7:1 ~35%.. and his equity in the pot with a set of jacks is ~35%

Generally if you shove with the best hand you want a call from worse hands and I've seen players stack off with top two in spots like this before. I don't see any value from showing your hand unless you think the villain will underestimate his pot odds and fold a lot. You could use slightly different language that might help as well, maybe "if you want to go chasing, i'll go gamble with you" to try and get a fold.

I suppose if you knew the pot odds and his equity were identical then showing your cards could help him lean towards folding... maybe with some choice phrases...

"I know what you're thinking,, do I have 7 outs, or 6? Well to tell you the truth, in all this excitement I can't count myself. But being as this is a made straight.. you've got to ask yourself one question.. Do I feel lucky? Well do ya punk?"

the point of poker is to get worse hands to call.

hero, are you playing over your bankroll? its okay, most of us do from time to time, but this seems like such a fish move. why not try raising to something like $400 and let V make a tough decision? and then showing him he's behind? makes no sense. by showing him and proclaiming you're ready to "gamble", what you really mean is "this pot is already too big for my tastes, I cannot afford mentally or monetarily to lose this pot".

and now V can whip you knowing that you're scared money. he can now inflate pots with you and put you in such gross spots if he's indeed competent.

i too avoid getting in pots vs myself

as for the rest of it...

OK. Here were my thoughts at the time.

I knew for sure that he had a set of jacks. He just wouldn't do that w/ an overpair. His PF raise screamed TT+ from OOP. At first, I put him on KK+ because he rarely raises from the blinds. I have played with him for 3-4 times a week for at least 3 months. OTF, if he had an overpair, he would have bet out. He doesn't try to "slowplay" big pairs OTF. When he check raised, I was almost 100% sure that he had JJ.

I quickly thought about the situation. I'll tell you what went through my mind after he check raised. $90 PF pot + $70 (my bet) + $170 of his money. That is $330. He had $200 behind. Against exactly JJ, I figured I was 2-1 favorite. If he calls my all in, that would be a pot of $750, of which my EV would be $500 (that includes $200 of my chips to put him all in). I thought that $330 > $300 and a sure win is better than risking it. (Something similar to insurance in blackjack?)

Was this not a EV+ move? Can anyone agree with me?

if you show your cards and your get him to call behind its +EV. if you show your cards and you flopped 2nd nuts, hes probably going to fold if he is any bit smart, and than you would be making a -EV move. because if you didnt show him, you would get him to call behind...therefore making this a +EV play

so you put him on KK+ and called with 97o?

nice man, nice.

This must be a reverse hero hand, and hero is actually villain with JJ. Otherwise this thread is useless.

its useless either way, since its just math based then

i just dont understand OP's intentions. does he want the call or not.

Easy fold pf