On my biggest downswing of the year atm (1/2 live) so i'm going deep into the lab, going through notes to see where i may be getting too out of line. Interested in some thoughts on this hand:

8-handed, i've straddled for 5. eff. stack in the pot ~250 and we've been playing for about 90 minutes (with the same 8 players)

Loose passive player raises to 16 UTG+1, aggressive reg calls behind in the cutoff and 2 more loose passive players call on the button and in the BB.

Action on me and i have A10o, i don't straddle often at all but when i do i try to squeeze limpers hard with hands that aren't the weakest but play better heads up - this is always done in the context of who has raised and who has limped and it will usually get through 80-90%+ of the time as players usually limp quite wide, and i generally do it when someone has open limped vs a raise unless i know someone is raising wide and won't defend.

I decide to squeeze to ~105 (~4x initial raise + limp amounts). Initial raiser folds, aggressive reg asks how much i have behind (i had ~225) and then jams for 316 total. It folds to me and i have played many hours with this guy, he will raise his strongest hands 99% of the time and HATES folding to 3bets so will call/shove wider than normal players at 1/2, based on previous spots we've played and the line he's taken i'm 99.5% sure he has 77-99 and i make the call.

Ideally, i'd be the aggressor with this hand but with ~460 already in the pot i figure the price is right if i believe in my read and i make the call for that reason. Additionally there is the other consideration that this is a thinking player and there are benefits to showing you are not afraid to get it in vs someone who 3/4-bets light, as i know he thinks twice vs the more LAG-y players.

WDYT? Particularly interested in thoughts on the initial 3bet, in the context of the reads, + then the call action.

I think you are trying too hard. ATo plays really shittily post vs a passive UTG raise. I'm not sure how the straddle works but I guess you are UTG rest of the hand after the blinds? If so, I'd probably fold ATo here at these stack depths or overlimp and hope to bink a straight or 2 pair. Any 3-bet raise is almost pot committing you out of position with an easily dominated hand against a passive player raising big from UTG.

So being overly ambitious here sets you up for the really difficult position you are in now. Call or fold I guess it's about the same.

Fair points. This situation is definitely an outlier in terms of usual sizings as there were more limpers and i was shorter than i usually am. Usually we're talking 2-3 straddle limpers, a raise to 30-40 and a takedown. It's not really my intention to see a flop when i know it will get through 80-90% of the time. Thinking in terms of EV, winning ~18 80-90% of the time and losing 30-40 20% of the time is surely profitable? I guess this assumes that the loss is capped at 30-40, which doesn't take into account if i get called and play 2-3 streets of action where i may be dominated.

I probably could've gotten away from this specific spot - there were 4 limpers (more than normal), a sticky aggressive reg, the 3bet was ~30% of my stack etc etc. Funny thing is if I was in the BB (last to act) instead of the straddle i probably would've folded.

Seems fine, Brother. With ATo in the straddle after an UTG2 raise, any of your 3 options (call, fold, or 3-bet as a bluff) seem fine, though calling is the standard play. Snap call the shove imo, hard to imagine you’re worse than flipping here, and you may even be ahead a small percentage of the time. (You would snap fold if it was the initial raiser who 4-bet you. I hope!)

Thanks. This particular player was one of the very few i would call in this spot, everyone else i snap fold (inc. the initial raiser).

For what it's worth, the read on his shoving range in this spot was correct.

Seems way out of line. Especially vs a player who wont fold.

3bet seems spewy to me when initial raiser's range should have us crushed and we're ~60bb deep. Subsequent call seems fine based on reads - think if he has cannibalised the nut portion of his range we should be in OK shape with the overlay already in the pot.

Mish-mash for sure .. I do worry when a passive Player decides to open (standard sizing?) and we commit 40% of effective into the field. Then again, when I see 'sticky' and 'aggressive' I've got to be committed once I get past the opener. The trail Players might end up with 99-JJ here on occasion but it's very possible they fold out to a raise like this one .. seen it plenty.

Beyond the hand, one thing that I tend to do during a downswing is play a bit more passive myself and let the game come to me. I don't want to say downgrade to ABC tactics, but just go about things a tad smaller than normal. In this case here it's a pretty large variance spot of over 250bb in what's probably 65-35 at best on average? You know your Player pool and how often you might be able to take this down without a Flop as well .. and Doyle did say sometimes you have to come in through the window!

I guess from a football perspective you decided it was time for a flee-flicker since your normal plays were stuck in the mud a bit. IMO as long as you go right back to your normal game, then these types of plays are a good show from time to time to keep your opponents thinking and perhaps stretching their games.

The other aspect is that if you are in a Reg heavy Player pool, then they see that you are not running well also .. and thus tend to lean towards remaining in hands more often IMO. This forces you to skew more towards the top of your range when seeking value. GL

Good post.

Thanks for the feedback, some great points. Much appreciated.

I had this absolute classic today:

6 limpers. I raise with AhKc in BB to 24. UTG calls it. Flop Ks9s4h. I bet 14 he calls. Turn Kh. I bet 40 he calls. River Kd. I check he bets 40, I raise to 140, he calls.


Just…..mind-boggling that there’s a guy limp-calling 12BBs UTG with a hand that has a 9 in it, lol.

Exploitive bet sizing on the flop?

Can you bet less with your value hands to get called and bet more with your bluffs to get folds?


Say you raise pre-flop and the flop comes:

Q♣️, 7♦️, 3♥️

with $35 in the pot and 2 callers.

Could you bet $15 with your AQ/KQ?

and bet $30 with AT?

Absolutely yes. Only thing i would keep in mind is to be careful if you play in a small playerpool and log lots of hours against many other regs. If you are doing it all the time it can quickly become a pattern that people can figure out.

Call, and don't sweat it. We only have to be good two times out of nine to break even on the call. Between the total WTF factor, the way that some live players actually think their diamond 8 is good here, and actual bluffs, we have enough equity to call profitably. I would even be tempted to call if my king were a club or heart.

A lot of the time the villain is going to hold the Ad -- but I don't believe it is going to be as much as 78% of the time.

A more interesting question is whether we should bet if checked to. (I lean towards yes.)

Preflop is marginal at best. Villain has a short stack and, opening in early position, should be presumed to have a strong range. I might be tempted to play against a deeper stack, but 50bb just does not offer enough implied odds.

We have two streets to play with and the board is not particularly scary. I want the villain's money, so let's make them put it in on the installment plan. Bet 120 on the turn and enough to put them in on the river -- which isn't even 1/3 pot at that point.

If our downbet causes the villain to "sense weakness" and jam, well, that's a good outcome too.

With two callers, I am betting small with my stronger value hands and nothing with my bluffs. Bet $10 into $35 with AQ and check back with KQ.

But yes, in general, against duffers who do not adjust, definitely bet exploitatively. In position against a single villain, on a Q73r flop I am betting 30% pot with my entire range. On any turn I am betting 30% pot with TPGK+, 70% with air, and checking back medium value, including TPWK.

On this flop I just small bet almost my entire range unless I'm OOP and they are really sticky. I guess I may check QQ sometimes and also hands like QJo/QTo/Q9s.

I try not to change bet size on bluff vs. value. So if I wanted to bet more than pot as a bluff, I want to try to have some value hands there as well that I also bomb.

I do not like the initial three-bet-squeeze. This is not the right hand to do this with. I would much rather have a hand like AQo than ATo, and even more would prefer a hand that plays well multiway -- I would rather three-bet with KQs. I would just fold this hand as not playable. Sometimes the best way to exploit brain-dead flat-callers is to fold.

Once the villain 4-bet-jams, we are in a pickle. I agree that flat/4-bet-jam is most likely to be a medium pocket pair, and so we are getting a good price to call. But the only reason we are in this pickle is because we did something stupid the first time the action got to us.

Why are you checking back KQ here with 2 callers?

If you're only betting $10 with AQ, aren't you giving some nice implied odds to hands like 87? or even a hands like 5d4d/Ad3d where it's going to be difficult to determine when they hit?

Assuming your numbers are accurate in terms of fold percentage your move is profitable so long as you play a Hit the flop for 2 pair or better or fold against any aggression post flop strategy.

Because in multiway pots you should in general bet much fewer value hands than when heads-up, because of the nut advantage of the aggregated range of all your opponents.

And you should in general use smaller bet sizes than heads-up because with multiple callers the SPR can quickly get out of control. Moreover, with multiple callers, you cannot prevent players from getting a good price to continue. An extreme example: a three-way limped pot, flop is Ah 8h 7s, hero in BB is first to act holding 8c7d. If we jam, and the next player calls, the remaining player holding KXhh is getting the right price to call the jam, especially if both players cover us.

Since we can't keep draws from getting a good price, we are not incentivized to bet large.

when a villain calls the clock on you in a cash game are they trying to get you to call?

If I call the clock on you it's because I don't want to die of old age waiting on you to act. I'm not sure for others if it's a tactic to drive any outcome other than to get you to finally act.

1/3. H has $1000. V1 has $1000. V2 has $700ish

V1 is a white guy around 55 years old. maniac. Running hot. Three betting hands as light as j9 offsuit. Raises 75% of hands. Cbets 100% of flops. V2 is a 30 year old extremely loose player. Seems like the best player at the table other than playing too loose pre and making occasional moves post. Can have any two cards always. Is very good at knowing where he is at in a hand. Have not seen him jam without the nuts. Only myself V1 and v2 have three bet any hands.

V1 is UTG and raises to $15. H is LJ and calls with 3h3d. V2 calls in HJ. Two more players call. $90

Flop Qc 5h 3s

V1 bets $50. H calls. V2 calls. All others fold. $240

Turn Jc.

V1 bets $50 again. H raises to $175. V2 Jams for $635. V1 folds. H asks V2 if he has a straight flush draw. V2 looks H in the eyes momentarily and seems very comfortable but does not ever speak. I feel like this is 55 90% of the time?

H?


$460 to call. $1100 in the pot.

Say the "next player" has AK and $500
and the "remaining player has Kh4h and $500
....and we have 8c7d and $500.


Against AK, we'd have $1000 pot with 75% equity. ($750) with a $250 expected profit.
Against AK and Kh4h, we'd have a $1,500 pot with with 52% equity. ($780) with a $280 expect profit.

Don't we want to pile money in when we have the most equity?