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nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand

03-07-2010 , 04:12 PM
utg limper is weak/passive 40/10, flatcaller is unknown, but seems like a solid, possibly loose aggressive opponent running a vpip in the low 20s and a pfr in the high 10s over a small sample size.
a) i think turn is a marginal b/f b/c i dont think he has too many made hands in his range given preflop action (villain is button). however, i think c/f and c/c both have their merits.
b) does anyone ever call this river? if not, what is the weakest hand that you call with? what is the weakest hand you value bet with?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $4.00 BB (0 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com


Preflop: with A, J
xgranbunnyx calls $4, 3 folds, xvinivici9586x bets $16, 1 fold, xluckyEXPRESSx calls $16, 2 folds, xgranbunnyx calls $12

Flop: ($54) A, Q, 7 (3 players, 6 all-in)
xgranbunnyx checks, xvinivici9586x bets $36 , xluckyEXPRESSx calls $36, 1 fold

Turn: ($126) K (2 players, 9 all-in)
xvinivici9586x bets $76, xluckyEXPRESSx calls $76

River: ($278) 5
xvinivici9586x checks, xluckyEXPRESSx bets $593.05 (All-In), 1 fold

Total pot: $278

Results:
Outcome: $278 returned to xluckyEXPRESSx

Last edited by vinivici9586; 03-07-2010 at 04:25 PM. Reason: put x's in names
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 06:44 PM
check the turn for pot control

you're not going to be getting value from any worse hands that will call

and most flush draws are calling as they probably have a str8/pair combo with them

as played c/f river to any bet more than 60% pot

it would also be helpful if we knew how much u had in your stack..
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 06:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinivici9586
i dont think he has too many made hands in his range given preflop action (villain is button)
if he's good he does ducy?
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 07:02 PM
cos he wants to keep the fish in?
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 07:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurt
if he's good he does ducy?
obviously, but the standard play is still more common
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 07:19 PM
i think turn is an easy b/f, and what is your stack size on the river? i def lean towards a call given your line unless we had a read that he overbets to represent a nuts or bluff type range with thin value (ala any two pair combo but AK). although I guess he could play 77 this way, but I probably look this up pretty often.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurt
if he's good he does ducy?
I actually don't really agree with this at all. it take a pretty unique and horrendous villain to make flatting the top of your 3betting range preferable.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 08:14 PM
Looks pretty standard to me, I'd need more of read or something to call that river, although his bet looks pretty suspicious because for him to have a hand would mean he slowplayed flop/trun.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 08:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thepizzlefosho
I actually don't really agree with this at all. it take a pretty unique and horrendous villain to make flatting the top of your 3betting range preferable.
OP is a nit, what purpose does 3betting AQ/AK/QQ serve if you're just going to bomb the fish out of the pot and find yourself against a reg that you're rarely going to cooler for a stack?
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 08:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurt
OP is a nit, what purpose does 3betting AQ/AK/QQ serve if you're just going to bomb the fish out of the pot and find yourself against a reg that you're rarely going to cooler for a stack?
he probably has like 25 hands on me, so i don't think this really applies. i also think it makes him less likely to try a big bluff on me.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 10:10 PM
looks good, i usually call river vs an unknown but not feeling too crazy about it
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 10:39 PM
Top Pair??? check/fold river???


Now i see why you dont post hands and just post strat
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 10:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurt
OP is a nit, what purpose does 3betting AQ/AK/QQ serve if you're just going to bomb the fish out of the pot and find yourself against a reg that you're rarely going to cooler for a stack?
I dont' know OP and I didn't know he was a nit. I was assuming that he probably had some of the typical reg on reg battles that most of us had and thus would be expected to be 3betting light here quite a bit.

so based on what you know I agree villain would be better off not 3betting. and if we knew that villain played very well and thus would have his full value range on the river than it looks a lot more like a c/f.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 11:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurt
OP is a nit,
Don't you say this about everyone?
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-07-2010 , 11:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rampage_Jackson
Don't you say this about everyone?
it doesn't even matter b/c we both have no hands on each other
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 12:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rampage_Jackson
Don't you say this about everyone?
oh come on, OP himself would confirm that his stats make him appear nitty to everyone that knows how to use a hud. same goes for you whether you recognize it or not (iirc i called you nitty in one of your strat threads which is no doubt why you made this post).

but to answer your question more straightforwardly, no. 13/10 and lower is nitty to me, with 14/11 kind of being in between nit and TAG.

don't be offended, really nothing wrong with being tight preflop (which is usually all i'm saying when i say someone is nitty). i suggest we put the matter to rest instead of further derailing the thread.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 12:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurt

don't be offended, really nothing wrong with being tight preflop (which is usually all i'm saying when i say someone is nitty). i suggest we put the matter to rest instead of further derailing the thread.
No prob, just think it would be more constructive to ask about what villain thinks hero's image is. Even if OP is a nit generally speaking, villain might not recognize that, or they could have a very aggro dynamic. In this case there was hardly any hands played versus the villain, so hero's image shouldn't be too relevant.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 01:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rampage_Jackson
In this case there was hardly any hands played versus the villain, so hero's image shouldn't be too relevant.
perhaps but i would just like to add that vinivici's reputation obv precedes him and if villain reads 2p2 SSFR/MSFR (especially SSFR) forums there's a good chance he at least has some kind of vague preconceived idea about his game.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 01:46 PM
for those who are suggesting or would suggest a fold, if i get to the river like this with ak, do you like a call?
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 05:01 PM
i like to be a station, just throwing that out there
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 07:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinivici9586
for those who are suggesting or would suggest a fold, if i get to the river like this with ak, do you like a call?
We mostly have a bluff catcher, and I doubt he is value shoving a two pair, but atleast you beat all other 2 pairs in case that's what he is doing.
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 07:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rampage_Jackson
We mostly have a bluff catcher, and I doubt he is value shoving a two pair, but atleast you beat all other 2 pairs in case that's what he is doing.
whaaat i don't agree with that but if he isn't then this is an easy call right? even got a blocker to JT

oh you mean if he had AK. still though
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 07:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hard2tel
whaaat i don't agree with that but if he isn't then this is an easy call right? even got a blocker to JT
i dont think he shoves 2pairs, i think he v-bets it standurrrdly, and his j10 sooted is likely to be red
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-08-2010 , 08:50 PM
if you think he vbets standard with 2p how is this not a river snap?
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote
03-10-2010 , 06:51 PM
Oh come on, does anyone ever overshove bluff?
nl400: turn line oop w/ marginal made hand Quote

      
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