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Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw

10-25-2010 , 05:54 PM
6 players limp and I check in BB with 56 of spades with a stack of $300
pot is $14 and villain has $150 and is in cutoff seat.

Flop comes K78 all spades and is checked to villain in cutoff and he bets $10
(He just sat down about a half an hour ago and I have no specific reads.) The button and SB fold.

I put him on a Pair of kings , A of spades ,possibly a set , or remote possibility of higher flush.

should I call and check raise turn if a non spade comes or should I raise the flop or should I have lead out with a bet?

I will post turn info after some replies.

Forgive me for the quality of this post as it is my 1st.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 06:04 PM
raise flop.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 06:20 PM
raise flop to $27
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 07:52 PM
With 7 players in the hand, I'm leading out on this board and expecting to get called.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 08:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gharp
With 7 players in the hand, I'm leadinhg out on this board and expecting to get called.
We want to get the most money in the pot as possible right now so check raising does that most effectively.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 08:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redsaddict
We want to get the most money in the pot as possible right now so check raising does that most effectively.
You're sure someone's betting?
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 08:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gharp
You're sure someone's betting?
7 handed on a monotone board? I would say a lot of the time. Especially at an aggresive vegas table where people may be prone to semibluff.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 09:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redsaddict
7 handed on a monotone board? I would say a lot of the time. Especially at an aggresive vegas table where people may be prone to semibluff.
I think the typical hand-makers and weak-tight regulars that inhabit a 1/2 game are checking these flops through a lot, but I suppose your mileage may vary. Having this flop get checked through would really suck, but certainly if you can see something like the player to your left giving off a tell that he's betting, then that's something to consider.

Also, since we're in early position, a check-raise has a good chance of facing much of the field with two cold bets here, which is going to scare away a lot of the naked s, and certainly all the one pair hands that might call one bet.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 10:13 PM
I prefer a flop lead, because I'm concerned it gets checked through, and I think a checkraise turns your hand face up. You'd be surprised how often KJo will call 3 streets when you lead out, but can find a fold against a c/r on the flop.

As played, definitely raise flop now (I'd make it $30). You need to get value now.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 10:58 PM
well I called planning to check raise any non spade turn card and everyone else folded.
The turn was the 2 of diamonds and I checked and the villain bet $25 and I check raised all in and was instacalled by Q,10 of spades but I rivered the 9 of spades to win.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 11:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by yakes
well I called planning to check raise any non spade turn card and everyone else folded.
The turn was the 2 of diamonds and I checked and the villain bet $25 and I check raised all in and was instacalled by Q,10 of spades but I rivered the 9 of spades to win.
it would have been SO sick if he had j10 of spades
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-25-2010 , 11:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by yakes
well I called planning to check raise any non spade turn card and everyone else folded.
The turn was the 2 of diamonds and I checked and the villain bet $25 and I check raised all in and was instacalled by Q,10 of spades but I rivered the 9 of spades to win.
yepp... sounds like a 1/2 table.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-26-2010 , 08:59 AM
OP you line is actually kind of too strong for your hand I know this sounds weird considering you flopped a flush but your line is so obv a flush villain is only calling with flushes likely unless he is horrible. just bet the flop IMO
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-26-2010 , 09:40 AM
children, we don't go broke in unraised pots without the nutzz. squeeze preflop, nit. Lead flop, b/f turn, c/c river (or bet if you make the joint, obv), imo.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-26-2010 , 11:24 AM
I think I usually just lead out here and go from there.

As played, we're OOP and it would suck to let villain check it behind, plus there are lottsa scare cards that will freeze the action, so I'm 3betting now to about $45.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-26-2010 , 03:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redsaddict
We want to get the most money in the pot as possible right now so check raising does that most effectively.
WRONG. What gets you more money? - EITHER 3 to 4 callers, random chasers and people who put you on the bare A with potential re-raisers and the option to re-re-raise the flop,
OR a checkfest, one bet and a check-raise that turns your hand face up and that chases away people with top pair hands who you can get 3 streets of value from and who haven't put anything in the pot yet.

Low stakes players rarely understand how bad checking monsters is.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-27-2010 , 10:33 AM
Ok; I see the value in leading on the flop.
For those of you that would lead on the flop what is your play if?
1) villain raises flop
2) villain calls on flop
3) villain calls flop and raises your turn bet

If you are raised on the flop I see villains ranges as a set or the naked ace of spades or a higher made flush
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-27-2010 , 11:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by yakes
Ok; I see the value in leading on the flop.
For those of you that would lead on the flop what is your play if?
1) villain raises flop
2) villain calls on flop
3) villain calls flop and raises your turn bet

If you are raised on the flop I see villains ranges as a set or the naked ace of spades or a higher made flush
1) I 3bet it. We're OOP and don't want to set up a situation where we check the turn and have that check thru and then he doesn't pay off on the river when he whiffs. Effective stacks are fairly shallow here so no point in treading carefully. And if we happen to be behind to a higher flush we still have a couple outs.

2) I lead the turn.

3) Assuming the turn is a blank, we'll probably lead ~$25 into the $30 pot. If villain does a 3x raise, if we were to call that would put pot at $180 and villain would only have $65 left; in other words, it's all going in on the river (where we wouldn't be able to fold getting such good odds). So no point in calling, imo. We have all sets, two pairs, TP/w draws, etc. beat. If we happen to be behind to a flush we have outs. I lead/push with these stacks sizes.

GcluelessNLnoobG
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-27-2010 , 11:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zaphkr
children, we don't go broke in unraised pots without the nutzz. squeeze preflop, nit. Lead flop, b/f turn, c/c river (or bet if you make the joint, obv), imo.
Does everyone else agree with the b/f turn play? Meh, effective stacks are fairly shallow (villain is only playing with 75 BB) and could easily be raising the turn with a set, weirdo two pair, TP / flush draw combo, etc. Plus we're never drawing dead (unless he happens to have our two magic outs).
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-27-2010 , 04:33 PM
I don't agree with b/f turn.
With effective stacks of 75 BB i am not folding this hand.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote
10-27-2010 , 05:57 PM
bet the flop.
Live 1-2 NL game in vegas; flopped flush with straight flush draw Quote

      
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