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Isolating weak players Isolating weak players

11-11-2021 , 01:40 AM
Today I had a huge fish at the table. A guy with plenty of money and pretty drunk. Playing crazy and raising pre a lot with trash hands like T2o, Q4o. Didnt like to fold pre and was sticky postflop. Everybody else was extremely passive and people had deep stacks. We had the best seat next to him on his left.
I know we should be isolating him a lot and really wide but something Im not sure about is what the best way is to play small PP and SCs vs this player type on such a passive table.

Is it better to isolate him with every single hand we want to play or is it better to also call with some hands like small PP and SCs like 54s, 76s, 98s and try to make hand multiway?
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11-11-2021 , 01:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SUYAPA
Today I had a huge fish at the table. A guy with plenty of money and pretty drunk. Playing crazy and raising pre a lot with trash hands like T2o, Q4o. Didnt like to fold pre and was sticky postflop. Everybody else was extremely passive and people had deep stacks. We had the best seat next to him on his left.
I know we should be isolating him a lot and really wide but something Im not sure about is what the best way is to play small PP and SCs vs this player type on such a passive table.

Is it better to isolate him with every single hand we want to play or is it better to also call with some hands like small PP and SCs like 54s, 76s, 98s and try to make hand multiway?
I’d prefer iso-ing with sc’s than pp’s.
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11-11-2021 , 05:03 AM
Suited connectors can be somewhat trouble hands multi-way and especially OOP. Suited connectors prefer to be played heads-up. Far less trouble with flush domination when we’re heads-up.

If your opponent is opening way too wide, just ignore his opens and 3bet with your standard opening range from each position.

In general I think it’s better for you to play heads-up pots against the fish than to allow other players to join in on the fun and split up the profit.

You can call the fish’s opens in late position with really marginal stuff like 64s-86s and 22-44 if you’d rather not bloat the pot with a marginal hand. But I’d generally just iso with all my strongest stuff. Like 55+, strong sc’s, etc.

Last edited by ChaosInEquilibrium; 11-11-2021 at 05:16 AM.
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11-11-2021 , 12:14 PM
In abstract I think seeing cheap flops with small PP and suited connectors is better but there are a lot of situations that favor one or the other. Look at stack sizes, if short then take the cheap flops. With a sticky villain like yours take cheap flops more often, isolate with weak or fit/fold villains you can bluff off hands. The worse the villain is more you will want isolate. The worse the table is in general the more cheap flops are worth while.

If other players are looking for cheap flops also then you will want to isolate more. If other players see that you are isolating and start reraising your isolation raises then see more cheap flops. If other players are isolating your target then consider reraising their isolating raises. This can lead to some weird meta-game battles if several players are trying to isolate fish.

If you have position on villain then see more cheap flops. From OOP you will need to uses more raises and limp/raises to isolate. If villain is hard to isolate from OOP then work to move at the table. If villain is passive then try to get some money in preflop with isolation raises or with lots of opponents. With aggressive villains it's easier to build pots and preflop size doesn't matter as much. It is easier to deal with bluffy villains heads up.

There are also ways villain's psychology plays into this. With some you will want to avoid being too obvious about specifically targeting villain. Possibly to the point of making some weak isolation raises against other players just to spread it out a bit. Some are just not aware enough to notice though and a few like the idea of going into one on one battle against a specific foe.
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11-11-2021 , 12:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SUYAPA
Didnt like to fold pre and was sticky postflop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SUYAPA
Is it better to isolate him with every single hand we want to play or is it better to also call with some hands like small PP and SCs like 54s, 76s, 98s and try to make hand multiway?
read those two points and there's your answer.

He's stick af why raise him with our entire range if he's calling? I would wanna 3bet 45s only if I knew he folds to 3bets like 85% of the time.
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11-12-2021 , 11:43 AM
Alright thanks a lot
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11-12-2021 , 12:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosInEquilibrium
Suited connectors can be somewhat trouble hands multi-way and especially OOP. Suited connectors prefer to be played heads-up.
It's actually the opposite. A suited connector plays better multiway, not heads up.
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11-12-2021 , 12:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Playbig2000
It's actually the opposite. A suited connector plays better multiway, not heads up.
If we have position, I agree. Out of position, I disagree. It's harder to semi-bluff OOP multiway -- I.e., if we flop a good draw with 76s and check (planning to check/raise) the flop is often going to check around and we miss our opportunity to bluff. Then what's our plan? Lead turn, lead river into a passive calling station field? Not loving our FE with this line if we get called and our draw misses. If we have position and flop a good draw we can just bet flop when checked to, and take control of the hand. We can decide to check turn and take a free card, or barrel on good turn cards. If someone leads flop wit ha weak bet, we can raise in position and take control of the hand. So many options available to us in position.

Finally about the trouble hand nature of small suited connectors. There are often many people limping or calling a PFR with all Kxs, all Axs, all Q7s+, etc.. Our flush outs are often overrated in very multiway scenarios. If the pot gets big after we hit a flush, we'll often be behind. Which is why I said that small suited connectors are trouble hands in 4+ player pots, especially very deep.

OOP I'd be 3betting a high percentage of the time from the blinds with 65s-98s against a loose opener. Against a tight open and a couple calls, in the blinds, I'd flick in the call and just proceed with caution .. well aware that my hand is going to be difficult to play.

Last edited by ChaosInEquilibrium; 11-12-2021 at 12:49 PM.
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11-12-2021 , 10:23 PM
It's an old school myth that suited connecters play better multi way. They're great for playing IP heads up as the aggressor. They don't make big hands often enough to be playing passively, multi way or oop
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11-13-2021 , 01:27 PM
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It's harder to semi-bluff OOP multiway
Against a sticky opponent there's not much point in semi-bluffing. The value in semi-bluffing is that you have fold equity and a chance to hit. Against an opponent who doesn't fold there's no fold equity. Betting just on our chance to hit is not a good proposition.
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