Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self.

12-13-2012 , 05:08 PM
Hi everyone, So I just put up two hands earlier titled Did I play hands correctly and Should I ever hollywood. So my last two hands of the night I ended up getting stacked by a different villain. I was wondering if you could tell me if I played it bad and I did my typical donking off my winnings or I just had to call.
Villain sits down for 300. Never played with him before. I raise preflop a couple hands and taken down blinds in position after he sits down might play into his image of me.

Villian UTG limps, mp calls folds to me in SB with pocket AA
Hero SB 530( AA): raise to 16
BB folds
Villian (300) calls
MP (500)Calls

FLOP (40) 5,3,5 (2 diamonds)
Hero bets 30
Villian calls
MP folds

Turn 8 offsuit
hero bets 40
villian calls

I put him on over pair and it actually crossed my mind he had pockets 8. MUB i know but the way he called but whatever

River 3 off suit
I check because I think he will bet over cards, missed flush and straight draw and hoping to induce bluff or value bet

he tanks and bets out 120
now I did not expect such a big bet and actually crossed my mind again he had pockets 8. I call he shows pockets 8.
Is my thinking right to check and call because he would bet overs and missed draws please let me know.
Very next hand

folds to Villian (UTG +1) calls, hi jack calls, hero (4,5 off suit) on button calls, sb, and bb calls

flop 3,6,9 rainbow
everyone checks

turn 7 putting a diamond flush draw out there
Villian UTG +1 ( 600) bets 12
HI jack (900) calls
Hero Button ( 230) reraises to 40
Villian reraises 90
Hijack folds
I tank and go all in and he instacalls

River 10
he shows 5,8 for 2nd nuts.

I just thought since I lost with pockets AA last hand to his 2 outer on turn. He thought I was steaming. should I have just called turn and call if he ships? thanks guys. just really trying to figure out if it was bad play or me donking my money. I have been on heater last couple days but usually when that happens I start degenning and losing my money. It's hard to keep prespective on yourself you know.

Last edited by coolgdelta; 12-13-2012 at 05:27 PM.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-13-2012 , 05:19 PM
I think both hands are okay tbh. Second hand is just a cooler.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-13-2012 , 05:21 PM
This is really, really hard to follow. I suggest reading a few other threads and trying to write with more structure.

Hand 1

What are the stacks of villains in hand 1?

How is there only 40 in the pot on the flop in hand 1?

Why did you only bet 40 on the turn in hand 1?

Why do you think 120 is a "big bet" here? Look at the pot. It should be about 160. It's 3/4 of pot. That's not huge.

My read on my last 2 questions is you don't seem to understand the concept of bet sizing very well.

Hand 2

Fold pre is probably the best option for you here. I'm serious. You are not good enough to play 54o in a multiway pot.

As played, turn is a total crapshoot. He's clearly strong, but we have no idea on much of their range as played. It's very possible he has a better straight or a set. You haven't given us any of a read to go off of so it's hard for us to say much.

I would say, and it's a little results oriented, you made the 3rd best straight here. This may not be a great place to go broke, what do you think most villains turn 3 betting range is? I probably get it in here, too, but I think we're in bad shape here fairly often.

This hand is actually easier to play if you bet the flop. It folds a fair amount of the gutterball draws of most villains, leaving your outs cleaner, it allows you to take initiative in the hand (which means you often will be able to check behind on the turn), and it creates a situation where you can get stacks in on the turn and river when you hit.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-13-2012 , 05:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rumor
This is really, really hard to follow. I suggest reading a few other threads and trying to write with more structure.

Hand 1

What are the stacks of villains in hand 1?

Sorry just entered stack sizes

How is there only 40 in the pot on the flop in hand 1?
it about 44-45 (16 x 3 - 5 dollar drop and 1 dollar jackpot)

Why did you only bet 40 on the turn in hand 1?

(thinking in my hand he had overs or pocket 6's or 7's or 9's, I believe 10's he would have raised preflop but he would have called bigger bet so I should have bet bigger right?)

Why do you think 120 is a "big bet" here? Look at the pot. It should be about 160. It's 3/4 of pot. That's not huge.

(seemed big bet because at that card room people usually don't do any pot sizing when betting so I got in the habit of it too. like if there is 10 dollars in pot people will bet 30 if they have big hand stuff like that I just fell in that habit too. I def have to work on that. )

My read on my last 2 questions is you don't seem to understand the concept of bet sizing very well.

Hand 2

Fold pre is probably the best option for you here. I'm serious. You are not good enough to play 54o in a multiway pot.

As played, turn is a total crapshoot. He's clearly strong, but we have no idea on much of their range as played. It's very possible he has a better straight or a set. You haven't given us any of a read to go off of so it's hard for us to say much.

I would say, and it's a little results oriented, you made the 3rd best straight here. This may not be a great place to go broke, what do you think most villains turn 3 betting range is? I probably get it in here, too, but I think we're in bad shape here fairly often.

This hand is actually easier to play if you bet the flop. It folds a fair amount of the gutterball draws of most villains, leaving your outs cleaner, it allows you to take initiative in the hand (which means you often will be able to check behind on the turn), and it creates a situation where you can get stacks in on the turn and river when you hit.
I know I def have to work on my game. I have no reads on villin because he just sat down. he was there for probably an orbit. If I bet flop, should I have checked turn and then bet river? I did hit and we got stacks in so I am confused on what the difference would have been if I bet flop unless the point was to take down pot by betting on river if all draws missed. Thanks trying to learn and thanks for feedback.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-13-2012 , 05:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgdelta
I know I def have to work on my game. I have no reads on villin because he just sat down. he was there for probably an orbit. If I bet flop, should I have checked turn and then bet river? I did hit and we got stacks in so I am confused on what the difference would have been if I bet flop unless the point was to take down pot by betting on river if all draws missed. Thanks trying to learn and thanks for feedback.
Bet turn when you hit, check when you miss generally. Same with river.

It's totally exploitable but these villains don't exploit you.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-13-2012 , 05:43 PM
1st hand:

Either 2 streets of value or 3 streets is fine. You have to call the riverbet given your turn underbet of 40 into 100 and your river check.

2nd hand:

Fold 54o preflop. Post flop was played fine.

Sounds like you're under-rolled or not used to variance.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-13-2012 , 05:51 PM
I am def under rolled. Pretty used to variance. I thought I played hands okay but I wanted to make sure I asked you guys first because I always have an overflated sense of my playing ability and I wanted the advice of people who are better than me and I respect. Thanks man.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-14-2012 , 02:43 AM
I don't really see anything here I'd call terrabad play.

Hand #1)

Best hand, worst position: raising to $16 makes sense here. Your vill calls twice from UTG. When 5, 3, 5x flops, you always need to be aware that trips is always a possibility. However, this looks pretty safe for pocket aces. The only hands that the vill could reasonably have, given he's coming in UTG, is 65-suited, or A5-suited. Not many other hands that have a five make sense unless it's pocket fives and he flopped quads. I wouldn't be too concerned to see that flop either.

40 into a ~50 pot on the flop is pretty standard. Your other choices would be a check raise, but there's no guarantee the vill will not just check along, and you don't want any freebies falling off here. The vill has called three times without making any sort of aggressive move, so you can't figure him for very much. It's beginning to look like he's drawing to diamonds. You see two offsuit cards fall on the turn and river, and by now there's just two hands that can beat you: pocket eights or treys. To just assume he must be holding one of those hands when he makes a routine river bet (his first aggressive move) is playing nitty and nut scared.

"I check because I think he will bet over cards, missed flush and straight draw and hoping to induce bluff or value bet. He tanks and bets out 120"

This would concern me: this hesitation before betting. Bluffers usually bet right away. They already know what they're gonna do; they don't have to think about it, and they want to look "strong", and so they seldom hesitate. The pausing looks like he has a problem, and that's figuring out how much he can bet without running you off. That says he wants a call here, and maybe you could have folded. This hero fold would require a pretty good read on the vill, but he hasn't been there long enough for you to get that read. Given the river bet wasn't grossly out of line, there are other hands he could believe he's betting for value that won't beat pocket aces here. That the vill had the one pocket pair that matched the turn card is just plain good luck on his part. If anyone played it poorly, I'd say it's the vill: he let you off cheaper than he should have. Consider: he has a pretty decent overpair to that flop. If it had been me, I would have raised it OTF. You lead 40, and I would come over the top for 100 -- 120. There are a lot of hands you could have that whiffed that flop.

Hand #2)

A button call with 45-off is iffy. This could be folded pre without too much difficulty. It's a tricky hand unless it flops very, very well (like a full). Against a 9, 6, 3 rainbow board, I'd like to see a card higher than that 9, as the way it stands now, only the deuce is a safe straight card. Catching a seven is iffy, but as the turn action went, there are always flopped sets that would play the same way. The flop check-around looks like the vill went for the c/r and didn't get it. If that were the case, he'd certainly go for the action on the turn, especially if he flopped top set, and wouldn't have to fear the seven made a higher set. It looks to him like that's what happened here: he had trip nines, missed a c/r, but now he's shipping after a turn seven, which would be great for him, as a seven makes a second best set. That it instead made him a higher straight than the one you made is just a cooler.

"I have been on heater last couple days but usually when that happens I start degenning and losing my money. It's hard to keep prespective on yourself you know.".

If tilt control is what you need to work on, then that's what you should concentrate on. Tilt doesn't just happen when you're down, or take some ridiculous and improbable beats. There's also winner's tilt that needs to be guarded against just as much as loser's tilt.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-14-2012 , 11:19 AM
Hand 1, Very standard cooler. The only mistake you made is to not bet on the river. In almost all cases, he is going to check behind and you are losing value.

Hand 2, Very standard cooler. Don't play 45s from the button. You aren't skilled enough to do it properly. Just toss it in, not just the next session, but for the next few years until you're ready.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-14-2012 , 12:13 PM
Kyuubimon: Hand 1: Dude that used to be my biggest tail. Someone told me that I thought about my hand before betting I had it and if I acted fast I didn't. Yeah I do played pretty nitty and exhibit mub sometimes. It's just that when I play LLSNL, people usually don't bluff big amounts like over a 100 no matter how big the pot is. So when he bet 120 and left behind 50 something in change I was like damn he probably hit the 8. because my range on him was small pocket pair or overcards or diamonds. but yeah that's just being results based because if I was called and he didn't have pocket 8s I would be like that was instacall. So I think I am just being results based right now and wondering if I was exhibiting my donk and degening habits.

2. yeah I put on a set and two pair and I thought based on the history of the last hand if he had those he would call my ship no matter what. I was just making sure my thinking was correct on that. I have no live friends that I can discuss friends with, I am the only degen out of my group.

3 I have to definitely work on my tilting. I just noticed I play very differently after I get on heaters and find myself making huge river bluffs with crazy stuff or making a lot of hero calls.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-14-2012 , 12:16 PM
Grima21: Yeah people have been telling me that advice on all of my post. Just fold 45 preflop. I definitely will from now on. I dont know for a couple of years because I don't know if I will be playing poker by then. Either from going broke or to busy with school.
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote
12-14-2012 , 12:19 PM
Oh yeah one more thing. People tell me I should bet every street which I agree but If he ships on after my bet on river. I should fold right?
I got stacked by villian.  Please tell me if I had to call or if I was my typical donk self. Quote

      
m