V is black guy in his 30s. No reads or history between us. He has multiple sizings pre and has shown 85s when he opened 3x before. 1800 eff. This is 3-5 spread limit with a 600 max bet. I expected my 3b to take it down as I have been very tight in the couple hours of play.

Hero in bb with 89hh

Pre: V in mp opens 15, co calls, hero 3b to 90, V calls, co folds

Flop (198) : 9c4d4h
Hero 60, V calls

Turn (318) : Qh
Hero..

I turned a bdfd

I originally thought bet, but I think his range here might be weighted to pocket pairs. In general everything you're ahead of will fold, and everything you're behind will call, with the possible exception of better nines.

I think I check call here and eval river.

I like pre and flop a lot. I would x-c with the pair to go along with our FD.

$210 (or larger), levering FE vs. JJ/TT.

Pretty good hand to take a defensive line with, since we can call pretty liberally with it.


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It seems pretty bad for hands like that to fold. If we bet it's for value vs. smaller pocket pairs, flush draws, JT etc.

You've played like a nit for 2 hours, finally get an extremely playable hand and decide to make it $90 to take "it" down, and by "it" I mean an incredible $37 that is in the pot (minus rake).

This three bet pre is 100% fine. Study a preflop chart


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I'm fine with 3 betting pre. Everything else about it is absolutely terrible. Hero sized up because he was scared to play post. He wanted to not play a hand with one of the most playable hands he's had in the last 2 hours. Villain has a lot of hands in his range that OP actually dominates and he wants to fold all those hands out of the pot in order to win like $30.

3 bet sizing is standard OOP.

Given small flop cbet sizing i think hero should bet again for value/protection. Villain shouldn't have many raises and against that range hero should not mind folding too much.

Checking back turn mostly caps hero's range and is not a great bluffcatcher on many rivers - especially when we lose to many 9x anyway.

Also agree that if we fire turn we can consider turning our hand into triple barrel bluff when called. I think hero does better cbetting larger oop on flop, but as played think we want to bet closer to half-pot.

3! Pre-flop sizing is not especially notable to me - i could see going $70-75 at lower end of reasonable sizing but 90 is still fairly normal.

I would use this size with all my 3bets. Why is taking down 6.6 bb uncontested such a bad result?

It's just a tiny amount of bigs to win compared to most 3bet spots I see and the amount we are risking is relatively high compared to the amount in the pot. Also, OPs mentality seemed to be more interested in taking it down then playing postflop.

I didn't know the games were still so soft in 2020 that it's common for one to call this sizing. The one time I saw a similar size-up in my game everyone chuckled and folded quite quickly. I'm not playing with world beaters by any means, mostly just mediocre poker players but a 6x raise with only 2 people in the pot makes it very easy for even bad players to fold weak hands. One has to be really desperate to see a flop to call in this spot.

Btw, what do you mean you use the same size for all your 3bets? You saying you 5x the raise +1x for each additional caller?

I’m a fish but in solver land we want to go at least $90+ in the blinds facing an open and a cold call to disincentivize profitable set mining opportunities from the IP player.

If we go $60-75 V will (correctly) continue with pps.

6+ BBs is a lot

wp OP imo.

obv a low EV spot with this particular holding but if we have some traps that play this way OTT we can feel comfortable x/c here and not worry too much about it

I suppose that's the case if most pots go 2 to the flop and players are just 3x'ing it pre. I have not played these LLSNL games.

It has nothing to do with how soft your games are. 6BB in a position you’re supposed to lose from is a lot for 9-high to win.

We’re not just sizing to “take it down.” Large sizing is just good for our whole range. Regardless of skill IP has an inherent advantage and offering him poorer preflop odds and reducing postflop SPR compensates for that a bit.

People laugh when someone makes a 3-bet like this because they’re bad players who don’t understand anything other than what they’re used to. Other players’ opinions are pretty irrelevant anyway because everyone you’re sitting with is clueless compared to anyone who takes the game seriously.

If the 3x sizing is capped like OP thinks it is then large sizing makes even more sense. It will be difficult for him to continue with any of the hands in his range. Before you say it’s a bad thing because our premiums will generate folds, if he doesn’t want to get run over he will be forced to have enough calls to give us value. If he overfolds that’s a huge win for our overall range.

+1 to this. Browni your posting is really on point these days, and have been for a long while.

4x +1 caller +1 oop

I disagree completely with this. If you are in games where 5x opens are normal, as are 4 to 5 of the flop, and where $90 can take $100 in dead money down preflop then I'd say this is not that appealing of a spot at all..


I don't know why he would think villain's range is capped. OP never said he thought it was capped.

If we are waiting for hands this strong to 3bet pre then it's going to be pretty hard for us to run villain over.

I did imply the 3x open is likely capped

You stated this: "He has multiple sizings pre and has shown 85s when he opened 3x before."

I have mutliple sizings pre. I've shown 85s when opening 3x. My range with 3x is capped at AA. Seems super symplistic to say he shows 85s so now his range is capped. I guess, ok.

All we can do is gather information presented. I have 60 hands on the guy, it’s going to be hard to draw definite conclusions.

At these stakes players don’t have refined and balanced ranges. If a player makes it 15 one hand and 30 another, what is the most likely reason?

one important thing of note though is that 98s is one of the worst suited connnectors to have in a 3-bet pot at this stack depth because we will be reversed on

Q-J-10 vs AK

65s > 98s imo

browni is an A+ poster ofc

I'd say he was weighted towards a weak range, but certainly not capped. Anyways, seems like I'm the only one against the $90 sizing. Of course if it gets called by weak hands a lot then it should be fine. Visualizing it in my head, I don't see that a lot but of course it depends on the villains.