Interesting live hand I was involved in.

8 handed 5/10 game at midnight. I've played one other session with villain for about two hours with no real hands between us. None this session also other than a few flopped made hands he's played pretty ABC imo.

Villian: mid twenties kid, military, sociable, other people peg him as LAG. He showed up 30 minutes ago and bought in for 1900. Dealers and table seems to know him so he's probably a reg. Thinking player. Value bet rather well with made hands so far.

Hero: mid twenties, probably have a thinking players image, haven't played any hands with villain so not sure what he thinks of me.

I have aprox 1500, villain barely covers.

I'm dealt 56 in the SB with villain straddling to 20. Folds to me, I make it 55. BB folds, villain calls.

Flop: 8810 (pot 115 [-5rake])

I bet 80, villain thinks a few seconds, calls.

Turn: 4 (275)

I lead out 125, villain raises to 375. I think for about 15sec and min raise to 625. Villain tanks for about a 45sec and waves "all in". I announce "I kind of wanted you to do that but now I'm not so sure." ~750 left into 2300.

Thoughts?

call and ship the monies. nh op

Fold pre? I've never been a huge fan of playing a bloated pot oop vs a decent LAG w/ 56. As played I'm not sure how you fold considering your small turn barrel sizing.

by 3 betting the turn aren't you turning your hand into a bluff?
i dont see what hand would call a 3 bet on the turn that you have beat except maybe ac10x. i dont think hes 4 bet shipping a naked 8, now that he ships i dont see how you can be good, but there is too much money in the pot in relation to your stack.
me personally i flat his turn raise and usually check call rivers, sometimes lead out.

teh good news is you still have one out!

I expected a call from AA/KK one club, 8x, and insta ships from boats and high made flushes. What really got me thinking was the time he tanked. I doubt the nut flush would take that long or any boat .

I had a plan for the calls and instaships. Not sure what hands he would have to rethink the play and still would push. Maybe he put me on an overpair with a flush? but seems unlikely with just my min raise. I figured the min 3bet showed strength. Just wondering how it got interpreted.

Discount AA/KK some because of pre. I'm not sure the min-3-bet shows more strength than a normal bet given stacks.

There are other options. 1) Flat turn and check call river. You can bluff catch a missed AcX hand. You can let him value own himself with 8x. Also, you can lose minimum vs all boats and better flushes. I kind of like the number of good scenarios there vs the downside of missed value vs draws and 8x. Kind of passive tho. 2) I guess you can also just ship the turn but that seems spewy, and against most villains only better will call. If your image is aggro you might be able to ship thin for value on the turn and get looked up by an 8 i f he puts you on a club draw, and not made flush. Maybe also AcAx or KcKx. As played I don't hate the min raise, but I think it can only be made as a planned bet-fold. This might be the best line, but you do have to actually fold! If you think he is capable of semibluffing all in on the turn, and don't want to be in this sticky spot against a laggy player, then one of the other two lines is better.

turn initial bet sizing is pretty bad given stack sizes. i'd probably be b/f'ing 200 on the turn. if you were a bit shorter, 125 and shipping over his raise would be good. but here you don't really have the luxury of inducing since when he gets it in you're not ahead 50% of the time.

3betting turn is bad for basically the same reasons. calling and either calling or folding river is way better.

i guess i fold as played but it's close. the way you described your plan depends a lot on timing tells; anyone decent as described in op will not be that predictable.

Bet less on the flop, more on the turn. The turn 3-bet is really bad. Like, really really bad. Fold now and feel pretty good about it I think. NH if he had Ac8 or something. But honestly the fact that you 3-bet the turn at all makes me think you shouldn't be playing 5/10, because it speaks volumes to me about the other mistakes you might be making on a daily basis.

He has AA/KK approximately never, he won't call your 3-bet with just a club when he can be drawing dead to a full house. He won't raise with only an 8 unless he's a donk.

His range on the turn consists of better flushes and boats and air. You're only option is to call and check/decide on the river. Or maybe even fold to the turn raise.

Can anyone tell me why my reply post was deleted? Seems a mod has deleted my reply.

I like a larger raise pre-flop. If you're going to attack the straddle, then bet 65-75. Flop bet of half the pot would be standard. But why is there even a question about what to do when he ships? Do you like to put half your stack in and then fold? Why do you play small suited connectors OOP, hit the flop and turn, then wonder what to do? Not only that, you make a move to play for stacks on the turn, then hate where you are when villain shoves.

I would probably check the turn for pot control and try and get to the river as cheaply as possible, maybe even fold depending on how much villain bets on turn and river.

As played, this is classic. Villain puts you to the test and you can't handle it. You have no clue what to do. That's exactly why the villain shoved. He knows you have something. Your cutesy min raise is weak, not strong IMHO. It says to me, I have something, I'm not sure what to do, I should do something, let's see what happens if I min raise. Huh? So, I don't know what to tell you. Call and hope he has something like Ac8, which would be pretty bad except he almost got you to fold. Based on your description of the hand, I'm guessing that you called and he had you crushed (the 45 second I've got you crushed tell).

I know that's a pretty hand and live poker is slow as ****, but I still don't think you can play it profitably here. Def raise bigger if you decide to give it a shot though.

i know this isn't helpful but does anyone else just fold pre?

I wouldn't but its not the worst. Limping and raising are both probably plus ev but not by a lot. If the rake is especially high or the bb/straddle especially good I might decide to dump it.

I normally would raise bigger but i didnt want to bloat the pot oop against an aggressive straddle. I didnt want to just call though cause if had a hand worth calling he would raise an unraised straddle if it got to him.

Now that i think about it, how do you like it as a blocking bet? If he just calls i canassume hes weaker and cbet Aragrag flops. If he raised i was out though.

I don't like the expression "bloat the pot OOP." Making it 55 instead of 70 gave the straddle a cheap price to do all kinds of annoying **** against you, and it made the stacks effectively deeper. If anything, you should want to bloat the pot oop when you have the initiative and a strong range.

If hes calling 55 hes calling 70. If hes raising 55 hes raising 70. IMO 57s has to hit hard to warrant any amounts my opponent is willing to bluff. If I get a pair or less on flop with the 55 raise (pot120), i can cbet 50-65 and go from there. If I baby hit the 70 raise (150) pot, my cbet is more likely to be 100ish. If he just flats the flop, the 70 raise makes a turn pot 350 where a 55 raise is 220 ish.

I was trying to think of the flops i barely hit or miss which i feel would happen more often than the ones i hit hard. 57 usually doesnt hit hard enough to stand against a raise, and OOP i wanted the pot smaller in case i was calling down or missing.

But appreciating all the feedback. I still want to see if my line of thinking is anywhere close to anyone else.

A bigger pf raise sets up a Cbet that will carry some fe. The 55 looks super wide and weak, and a good player is going to need to be at least 2 barreled a ton in position with these stacks.

If you need to block pre, it's a fold IMO.

I think you're range evaluation is slightly off and you shouldn't include many overpairs in there. Easiest and most profitable play is to just call turn and probably call a safe river. I only like a 3bet if you want to keep looking like you're bluffing if you have that kind of image. You want to raise bigger in general oop because position matters less when the pot to stack ratio is bigger. It's fine to bloat pots oop against good players so long as your range is strong enough to support it.

Just interjecting that if he c/f the flops he misses, it will be more than he hits, so you want to bloat the pot b/c you win more than you lose. FWIW, I think a bigger preflop bet encourages him to fold more and it makes him fold more postflop when you can lay down bigger pressure on the flop/turn and river vs a weak hand range.

Mt first guess is villian has connectors around 910-QJ with a possible club in his hand, the reasoning is villain is straddling and most people tend to (defend) straddle with connectors (from my experience).

Then possible combos of AK-QJ.

Then possible lick box via holding onto cards like 10-8, 10-7 etc

I will be considering calling his all, considering he is defending his stradle and he has only been at the table for about 30mins and then considering folding to find a better spot to go all in.

Final answer, I would call, and if I lose, learn from it and take mental notes on Villain for next round!!!

pre is just burning money.

why would you 3 bet the turn and then ask us what to do? haha. if you 3 bet the turn it was to induce an all in so you can snap call.

normally calling turn >>>> 3betting turn.