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5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" 5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?"

10-04-2008 , 11:39 PM
this is a hand i payed live this weekend would apprciate your thoughts on it, did i just go mental? is my line standard based on read?
5/10 live i am fairly new to the table and have played many hands with at least 6 players villain in this hand is a new t me (american navy boat was in the docks and he was one of the pilots off the ship) form what i had seen so far although limited villain seems to be solid consrvative and not prone to reraising.

two limpers i am in cut off with Ah9c and raise to $40, villain is button and calls blinds fold and limpers call. pot is $175
flop comes 235 with two clubs checked to me and i lead for $115 thinking this flop is unlikely to have helped any one except for flush draws and sets, so i will generally get raised by a set and a straight and called by a flush draw or pair of 66 77 88 etc so my lead is primarily designed to pick the pot up and try to evaluate possible holdings depending on players actions behind.

villain tanks for 20 seconds and calls all other players fold

turn card is the Jh (pot is now $410)

If i had been called in more than one spot or if I had been raised on the fop I would have been done with this hand and just check folded however were now heads up and i feel i play and read better than the villain so i'm not quite ready to give up on this one just yet.

i tank for a short while deciding whether or not to continue, my feeling is at this point that the villain prolly has a mediocre flush draw or some kind of combo draw like a pair and straight draw or similar. i decide to fire again this time $285, villain goes into the tank for 40seconds and then calls.

my feeling now is that he must have a drawing hand i have shown obvious strength repping a big hand. I thnk he mucks a weak flush draw on the turn and with the long tank before he called i'm leaning towards a combo draw maybe the K4 clubs for up and down plus K hi FD, maybe the 67 clubs for a gutshot SD and an FD.

the river card pairs deuces and does not complete the FD so board reads

2c 3d 5c Jh 2h

I went into the tank for a long time on the river my thought process here is I have A9 and i believe villain was drawing and has now missed whatever he was trying to hit. I can beat Kc4c, 4c7c, Ac6c, Ac7c, Ac8c, i can also beat all 4cX hands that didnt make a pair
i can't beat 45, 34, Jc4c, 3c4c, 66, 77, 88, 99,1010, Ac10c, AcJc, AcQc AcKc
although i dont think he has 99,1010, AJc+ as he raises these hands at some point IMO
at this point i have been in the tank for approx 30 seconds and need to make my decision do i check to him hoping he will check behind and my A hi is good, do i check with the intention of calling a bet with A hi, do i check with the intentin of calling a shove if he goes? i have $585 left villain covers and the pot is now $980 i have a 60% pot bet left

so what do we do empty the clip give up or make a sick call if he shoves?

Last edited by sparky999; 10-04-2008 at 11:51 PM. Reason: cos i suck at posts and always forget to put everything i should in the first time
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-04-2008 , 11:47 PM
NB
although villain seems a solid player he does play too many hands and likes to limp call with Kx and Ax suited even Qx and possibly some Jx suited hands as well
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-05-2008 , 12:49 AM
If you really read him for a draw, then ship it in. If he's being stubborn with a mid pair, the likelihood of him folding at this point is slim, since he's already put in half his stack, he'll be getting almost 3:1, and he just docked (meaning he's probably willing to gamble). If you check and he ships it, you can't call this. But if you are planning on doing that, you may as well shove.
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-06-2008 , 06:08 PM
Have you been active since you sat down?

I agree with Gfat and I like the bluff.... just dont c/c lol.
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-07-2008 , 11:27 AM
The problem here is that you're representing a big pair from the get-go and he knows you wouldnt value-shove an overpair into a board like this. He's representing some kind of weak draw + a pair. The fact that he tanked on your two barrels tells you that folding was an option, so 99% of the time he doesnt have what you would call a "monster" here. My guess is your looking at a weak pair and you have to decide if he's capable of putting you on an overpair when you make a really thin, value-ish bet on this river. I don't think you have to shove here to win the hand, put in a blocker bet - bluff of about $300 and see what happens.






Nice Hand.
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-07-2008 , 12:23 PM
raise a little more preflop with two limpers in there already
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-07-2008 , 08:11 PM
On the river he only needs to fold 38% of the time for your shove to be profitable.

I'd shove here.
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-07-2008 , 08:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karona the False
The problem here is that you're representing a big pair from the get-go and he knows you wouldnt value-shove an overpair into a board like this.
I would shove an overpair here (the 2 pairing the board is a great card for an overpair).
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-08-2008 , 04:00 AM
Do you think he is doing the fake-tanking with a monster?
If he has a monster, you should check-fold.
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-08-2008 , 04:31 AM
40 to go with 2 limpers with this kinda hand is a little weak imo. I mean with a9 offsuit your pretty much looking to pick up the pot right here vs a couple of weak tight nits amiright? That being said I think you have a good read on the rest of the hand but it still kinda screams like a line a tourny player would take here. If the guy just got off a navy boat im gonna say he is going to look to gamble. I'm sure you could cont bet flop, shut it down turn when called and look for a better spot later. Also he is probably gonna call you with 66-1010 and say I put you on ak lol
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-08-2008 , 04:35 PM
After some thought, I think this is a good spot to value-shove an overpair. Two things that would arise some suspision are the pot-sweetening pre-flop raise and the 3-bomb line you took that screams of AK. Im pretty sure your read is accurate but his read is more important here. Do you think he can put you on a better pair than his? If yes, make a calculated-looking value-shove on the river (that's really a bluff), IF no, then just wait for a better spot.
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote
10-08-2008 , 10:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karona the False
The problem here is that you're representing a big pair from the get-go and he knows you wouldnt value-shove an overpair into a board like this.

Does villain think you suck?

The board is great. It's live. With stack sizes and how you got there this is a shove 100% of the time with an overpair unless you have some tell or other read on villain.
5/10 live 100BB 'to empty the clip or not to empty the clip?" Quote

      
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