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/5 Can I go broke here? /5 Can I go broke here?

03-25-2011 , 07:08 PM
Villain 1: your average fish, he was having a bad day and complaining like crazy
Villain 2: Pretty solid. Didn't raise a lot PF and was waiting for good values to put his money in.
Hero: tight image

$3/5 NL (9 handed)
UTG
EP
MP V1
MP+1 ($250)
HJ V2 ($600)
CO
Button
SB
BB Hero ($500)

Hero is dealt J7

3 folds, 2 calls, 1 fold, 2 calls, Hero checks

Flop ($23) J72
SB checks, Hero bets $15, V1 calls $15, V2 nonchalantly raises to $45, 2 folds, Hero?

Should I plan on risking my whole stack in this hand?
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-25-2011 , 07:31 PM
well, i'd deffinantly reraise here . lol
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-25-2011 , 08:52 PM
These limp games, lol. I would say it boils down to knowing raiser a little better. will he limp AA and then start shoveling cash postflop? Will he limp AJ and then raise it on up on a Jxx flop and get it in?

I know players who wont limp AA nor go crazy with AJ on Jxx flop. Against them i would call, and see if he bombs the turn if the heart whiffs. If the player is as many describe here and just go nuts with TPTK, then 3 bet and get it in.

I also would have overbet the flop by a little. This would give me a little more info. on the next action. This $15 bet makes anyone with any J want to raise i would guess.
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-26-2011 , 12:03 AM
I prefer to only lead a flop with a monster when I intend to stack off, which is pretty marginal here in a limped pot--as played, I probably flat flop, lead turn. If he raises the turn, you can evaluate whether you are good, but any draws and Jx will likely flat a turn lead, giving you value and information. A turn lead also confuses the hell out of villains, so they usually play their holdings face-up.

If I did not want to stack off, I prefer a check/raise on the flop and a fold to a 3bet.
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-26-2011 , 01:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IWearSportsJerseys
I prefer to only lead a flop with a monster when I intend to stack off, which is pretty marginal here in a limped pot--as played, I probably flat flop, lead turn. If he raises the turn, you can evaluate whether you are good, but any draws and Jx will likely flat a turn lead, giving you value and information. A turn lead also confuses the hell out of villains, so they usually play their holdings face-up.

If I did not want to stack off, I prefer a check/raise on the flop and a fold to a 3bet.



good show jersey. Thats a line i NEVER USE, but i may start cause i like it. i like it ALOT.
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-26-2011 , 01:36 AM
I appreciate the accolades from a player of your caliber.

Leading the turn with a range of TPTK (bottom) to an unconfident 2 pair (top) after a flop c/c is awesome. It valuetowns the hell out of fish and competent regs, alike, and we are able to fold quite easily to a raise. If one is worried about exploitation, it can be balanced by sets and completed draws when we feel enough money is in the middle on the flop to stack off on the turn and river.

But live, one can afford to be exploitable without the assistance of a HUD .

Even though I tend to use this line when the flop is not raised, we are deep enough in this spot to utilize it quite effectively.

Last edited by IWearSportsJerseys; 03-26-2011 at 01:45 AM.
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-26-2011 , 01:47 AM
im not a fan of stacking off here given reads, in fact i'd hate it
he can't have j2 or 72, reads are that he doesn't raise light so improbably for aj/kj. he can have 77 and possibly jj if he doesnt open a lot pre, 22 for sure.

looks like a set or a fd/sfd, does he play those passively, especially deep?
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-26-2011 , 01:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IWearSportsJerseys
I prefer to only lead a flop with a monster when I intend to stack off, which is pretty marginal here in a limped pot--as played, I probably flat flop, lead turn. If he raises the turn, you can evaluate whether you are good, but any draws and Jx will likely flat a turn lead, giving you value and information. A turn lead also confuses the hell out of villains, so they usually play their holdings face-up.

If I did not want to stack off, I prefer a check/raise on the flop and a fold to a 3bet.
Good advice. This is actually usually the line I use in these spots. By check/raising the flop it becomes even easier to determine where you are and still gain value in the hand when you are called and lead the turn. I often will lead with a set, though.
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-26-2011 , 02:15 AM
In regards to IWSJ line of flatting flop raise then leading turn, Are you suggesting that you would lead turn regardless of what comes off? I'm just curious, I also never really use this line, but seems to hold some weight.

Personally I'm thinking I would probably put it an a raise here even with villians discription. Reason being is the lack of turn cards I like, and the strong likely hood that I'm ahead currently but have a very vunerable hand.

Most villians raise JJ pre, plus the fact that you hold a J and a 7, drasticly knocks down the possibilities of sets of 7's or J's. So really the only hand I'm afraid of is pocket deuces. I'm not afraid of getting it in here.

Another thing to take into account is how competent vill is. This could change things IMO.
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-26-2011 , 02:18 AM
If a heart rolls off, I probably c/c the turn and c/f river, b/f the river if turn is checked through--turning 2 pair into a bluff would be a real pity.

If a J or 7 rolls off, I lead turn weak/3bet, for balance. Can't be leading the turn only when we intend to fold to a raise.

Last edited by IWearSportsJerseys; 03-26-2011 at 02:27 AM.
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-27-2011 , 02:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IWearSportsJerseys
I prefer to only lead a flop with a monster when I intend to stack off, which is pretty marginal here in a limped pot--as played, I probably flat flop, lead turn. If he raises the turn, you can evaluate whether you are good, but any draws and Jx will likely flat a turn lead, giving you value and information. A turn lead also confuses the hell out of villains, so they usually play their holdings face-up.

This only applies to a limped pot, right? If I raised PF, this would be a b/f, correct?
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote
03-27-2011 , 09:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IWearSportsJerseys
I probably flat flop, lead turn. If he raises the turn, you can evaluate whether you are good, but any draws and Jx will likely flat a turn lead, giving you value and information. A turn lead also confuses the hell out of villains, so they usually play their holdings face-up.

If I did not want to stack off, I prefer a check/raise on the flop and a fold to a 3bet.
I think this is right on. However, I would only check/raise this flop if I've seen some LAG play from opponent.
/5 Can I go broke here? Quote

      
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