squid_face is a solid, respectable pro with a long track record of winning poker. He knows what he is talking about, and he is clear about his reasoning.

"All this perceived range talk" includes my post above, which went through a range of ranges, and which concluded that the decision whether or not to call depends on our read of the villain. If you characterize that as using perceived ranges to justify a call, then you are simply, utterly, completely wrong.

Obviously, if the villain's range is only {KK+} then this is a fold. Yes, we have to go with our reads. The OP's read is that villain's range is {QQ+, AKs, AKo}. The pot odds demand equity of 41% and QQ's equity versus this range is 40%. This is a close spot, much closer than you seem to think.

Learn how to use an equity calculator. Equilab is free.

Thank you for the kind words. But I'm going to stick to my guns here. For 70 bigs V a lag I am simply not folding here after I have 3! to 60. I have played enough 2/5 in my time to think that it is a shrug show me kk/aa here. Folding I believe is a mistake. If its nit on nit violence I am fist pump folding - but its not.

???? Uhhhh
This is only KK some times every day of the week, but it's not KK every time, every day of the week. If you think all they ever have here at this stack depth is KK+ you are definitely folding better some times on some days of the week - which, honestly, is prob fine. After it all gets mathed, its marginal on both sides. But we've all seen 9Ts, 88, JTo either show down or shown to needle plenty of times, so you can make this call whether it's a Monday or Saturday, prob less on Sundays, more on Thursdays, but calling off is fine every day of the week.

love the unintentional irony of you bolding a statement by squid that you claim is fish talk (even though it's correct) and then follow it up by literally stating something a fish would say - which is putting someone on one specific hand even though there is a range of hands that are possible, but fish don't understand this, which is why we routinely hear them bemoaning "i put you on AK" as they pay you $ because we value bet thinly and they're not used to seeing that.

OP: is $15 the standard open in the game?
is it V's standard open size from UTG?
if you're not sure, do you have any ideas of V's open sizes from any positions and what he was holding?

in my games, sometimes this sizing is indicative of a weaker holding, which is player dependent read. sometimes it's just their standard open, so we can't read too much into it. not sure if you have any info on it, but it doesn't appear to have been asked yet.

I agree if we use perceived ranges based on what a computer states as perceived we can plug in any set of parameters
TO JUSTIFY A CALL
and using purely math to make a decision we are unsure of is ok

BUT
I'll stand by my statement
if we fold an occasional winner vs calling off a high % of losing hands
we are ahead of the curve

I out grew the NEED to call just to see what I already thought 15+ years ago

A bad lag sure we call it off here, some who doesn't see how much of a nit I am , sure we call
but someone who knows I'm a nit ;to run a pure bluff when I could have AA if they don't
CONGRATS TO THEM

and sorry if I took your lunch money in my travels but if your overly eager to give it away then I'll take it

That's fish talk.

Grunch
If he's opening 86o full ring UTG I'd lean towards bad LAG...with 70BB you'd just have to GII, his range would have to be KK+, AxKs to fold and even a good LAG will GII QQ+,AK with your stack size

Pretty epic to put the fish stamp on Squid. Jeeeze thats som legendary stuff right there.

He doesn't have a sizing tell. And the 86o might have been 6 or 7-handed, but still pretty wide nevertheless.

Call me a fish, but I gotta agree with Squid here.

And call me a mega fish, but if you’re second guessing if your image is nitty enough that you should fold QQ short-stacked, you should consider working on opening up your game and what that entails.

This should be a pretty easy GII imo. Players could seriously abuse you preflop if they know you wanna fold QQ $350 deep.

Imagine not ignoring anything snowman says

Why are you always playing these games short?

Any ways vs a short stack he is gonna ship it with TT+ and AK.

It depends on whether I think I have an edge on most of the table. If not, short. If yes, deep.

Why do you keep posting hands where you’re playing short. Did you just lose a pot and not get a chance to top up?

AP LOL do not fold.

Edit: let me be more helpful. This dude has a range wider than the ocean. Any legitimate strategy that will prove to be unbeatable for him will include calling off a jam with queens. How do I know? Well because when I use my PkrCruncher slider, I need over 65% of hands before 86o shows up. Even if we assume he was just bored and raised it up for the lulz, he probably has around 35%-40% frequently. Or 500 combos about. 12 combos crush you. 17 (AK and the other two QQ) chop. Everything else you crush. If he’s only jamming these 29 combos, that’s 470 or so combos that he has to just call with (where QQ is killing it) or fold (and you win dead $). To properly fight back, he needs to jam light sometimes. Hence, QQ is a call.

If you find yourself in this spot a bunch and he just shows QQ+/AK every time, you can add to your exploits and make some superhero folds. But you showed a worst case scenario (perfect info QQ+/AK), and almost had the price.


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agree with bolded
and agree its close as OP stated in his post of his perceived ranges.

my point is simply to state that giving OP's self proclaimed nit image
its highly likely a 4-bet from V is more weighted toward KK here than AK
and when its close there's no reason to go higher variance with a call.

There’s at least as good of a chance you’re leveling yourself as there is that you’re exploiting a nutty 4-bet range by folding. Just play ranges based on the information you do have instead of guessing. You know villain opens way too wide. If QQ is not very high in your range then you’re not 3-betting nearly enough.

your post just proves my point

just because a lag opens wide against the entire table
DOESN'T MEAN THEY will 4-bet a NIT wide
this is exactly opposite of a guess
we have a good solid read and should apply it
otherwise why bother with reads at all