2/5 NL: Range Required to 4! Semi-Bluff a SB's Likely Squeeze of 30 BB's of Dead Money? - Page 5 - Live Low-stakes No Limit Poker Forum

Two Plus Two Forums Poker Strategy Live No-Limit Hold’em Cash

2/5 NL: Range Required to 4! Semi-Bluff a SB's Likely Squeeze of 30 BB's of Dead Money?

Post Reply Subscribe

...

Page 5 of 5

1 2 3 4 5

Page 5 of 5

1 2 3 4 5

07-29-2015 , 01:54 PM

#101

bobman0330

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 24,234

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Parker

This is true, and in reality, no one in LLSNL has a 4bet calling range less than KK, so 4bet calling range and 5bet shoving range should technically be the same.

So by adding hands to your 4bet range, you are merely increasing frequency and to fold out those that may have too many hands in their 3bet range.

And I agree with mikko. If you are taking the frequency approach, your cards don't really matter, especially when your equity is in single digit against V's range regardless what you have. In this case, 88 becomes not much different than 72o.

On the other hand, 88 does add value against V's 3bet range, because it is wide enough that 88 has room to maneuver in a deeper game.

However, I wouldn't say that adding 88 into 4bet range is exploitable if you understand the intent of 4betting someone in LLSNL; you are actually the one exploiting.

Any hand with an A or a K in it runs up against KK+ 25% less often. And A5s has 26.6% equity against KK+.

Against typical opponents, the only value 4bet is AA. The only question is whether you bluff and which hands you choose for a bluff.

Quote

07-29-2015 , 01:59 PM

#102

Richard Parker

banned

Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 13,949

You're still kind of missing the point.

Question is whether those hands are better off in the 3bet calling range.

Quote

07-29-2015 , 02:00 PM

#103

Playbig2000

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 13,425

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikko

That's kinda my point. If I decide to never 4 bet bluff.

I am rarely ever gonna be exploited for it. as Playbig suggested.

If you never 4bet bluff against a light 3bettor and you are giving up on the pot by either flatting and hoping to hit the flop (which happens almost never) or folding, and if the 3bettor is light to begin with, what is he doing to a 4bet? He's going to fold thinking you really have a hand.

So unless he has QQ+ (which would be rare for a guy who habitually 3bets a lot in a session) he's going to fold.

Edit: this should go without saying, but I am referring to our raising hands such as K9s, A10, A5s, KJ, K10, KQ, A2s, K5s, etc. No PP's really or AK, AKs. Those will all be played different depending on the situation at hand (since I would hate to fold or flat to a 5bet obviously).

Last edited by Playbig2000; 07-29-2015 at 02:07 PM. Reason: see Edit: above

Quote

07-29-2015 , 02:06 PM

#104

bobman0330

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 24,234

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Parker

You're still kind of missing the point.

Question is whether those hands are better off in the 3bet calling range.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobman0330

That would fall under "which hands you choose for a bluff." It's hard to imagine a villain with a 4bet calling range of KK+ against whom calling with A5s is the best play though. Either his 3betting range is so tight you just need to fold or it's so loose you need to bluff out all of his hands.