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2-5 JTs 2-5 JTs

12-06-2019 , 07:23 AM
Hero in co with JT

EP, MP, HJ limp 5, hero (CO) 30.. BB, EP, MP, HJ call

flop (152) : 622
4 checks hero..

I have 1100 and everyone covers (no one is deeper than 1500)

Edit: Sorry this is 3-5, not that it matters much
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 07:46 AM
Just check back..that's too many people to get all folds someone will have a PP and peel atleast the flop. Your going to get into a super bloated pot with a weak hand if you bet flop. There are only 12 turns you like so check and try to hit one
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 08:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thegibson
Just check back..that's too many people to get all folds someone will have a PP and peel atleast the flop. Your going to get into a super bloated pot with a weak hand if you bet flop. There are only 12 turns you like so check and try to hit one
+1
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 08:50 AM
Check. If we're more like 3 ways we can start thinking about betting similar combos (two overs and a BDFD) but I'd rather it was the higher stuff like AJs-AKs. There was another thread about this exact topic kicking around just recently.
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 09:33 AM
Checks, and should have just over limped pre.
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 10:54 AM
If you're going to be raising pf need to go bigger.

I don't mind to start betting flop, but you should have a pretty precise idea of which hands you're doing it with. Spots like these are way easy to over c bet because you have a ton of your range that whiffed here just like everyone else. And if you start betting you need to follow up on a lot of turns and rivers for it to be good. If your plan was to just bet ince and then shut down just check back instead.
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 12:07 PM
This is a great spot for a limp pre.

As played, check.
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 12:54 PM
JTs is a fine hand to raise, assuming we can thin the field down to three-way or heads-up. if we are only iso-ing with big pairs or AK, our hand is going to be an open book postflop.

OP's sizing is pretty standard in a tight game where people can find the fold button. However, in a game filled with people who didn't drive all this way to the casino to fold, we do want to size up. My starting sizing in LOLow-stakes games is (big blind) x (6 + 2 x (# limpers) ), in this case $60.

One thing I do at a new table, if I find that people are calling raises liberally, is conduct what I call a "secret auction," where I start with a standard sizing and see how many people call, and size up a bit the next time I raise, and see if that affects the number of callers, and keep sizing up until I find a size that gets the job done.

Sizing up like this exposes us to bigger losses if we get three-bet, so we should tighten our raising range (and maybe this means not raising with JTs). But this is less of a concern if people are not three-betting at all often.

As played preflop, this hand is a slam-dunk check, for the reasons given by others.
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 01:37 PM
Bigger pre. Not limping this deep.

I like a flop bet. Not sure what sizing I like. Calling ranges are probably actually fairly inelastic since most air is going to fold unless sizing is very small and most pairs will likely call at least once unless sizing is very big. I don’t think this is a downbet spot in theory given how deep we are and the fact that our value range is quite strong but I think bluffing small is good exploitatively here.

We don’t never bluff just because we’re multi-way.
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 01:55 PM
I really need some reads before I raise pre or bet flop.

Read-less, I limp (and I like limping this hand with three limps in front of me, anyway -- there are others I'd rather raise) and I check the flop.
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 03:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanBostick

One thing I do at a new table, if I find that people are calling raises liberally, is conduct what I call a "secret auction," where I start with a standard sizing and see how many people call, and size up a bit the next time I raise, and see if that affects the number of callers, and keep sizing up until I find a size that gets the job done.

Sizing up like this exposes us to bigger losses if we get three-bet, so we should tighten our raising range (and maybe this means not raising with JTs). But this is less of a concern if people are not three-betting at all often.
For these types of tables, if we are not raising the bottom of our range with hands like JTs or KQ (specifically in MP or late position, should we be overlimping or just folding?
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 03:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by browni3141
Bigger pre. Not limping this deep.

I like a flop bet. Not sure what sizing I like. Calling ranges are probably actually fairly inelastic since most air is going to fold unless sizing is very small and most pairs will likely call at least once unless sizing is very big. I don’t think this is a downbet spot in theory given how deep we are and the fact that our value range is quite strong but I think bluffing small is good exploitatively here.

We don’t never bluff just because we’re multi-way.
It’s probably closer than initially perceived between checking and c-betting. Tough to get a c-bet through 4 players but there are a lot of turns we can barrel successfully to bluff sticky pocket pairs and it’s doubtful more than one opponent continues on this texture. I don’t dislike betting and checking is fine too.
2-5 JTs Quote
12-06-2019 , 03:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by freshmndave
For these types of tables, if we are not raising the bottom of our range with hands like JTs or KQ (specifically in MP or late position, should we be overlimping or just folding?
Both of those hands are far too good to fold in this spot (and KQs is by no means the bottom of our range; if it's the bottom of yours, you are likely playing too tight).

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatmanonguitar
It’s probably closer than initially perceived between checking and c-betting. Tough to get a c-bet through 4 players but there are a lot of turns we can barrel successfully to bluff sticky pocket pairs and it’s doubtful more than one opponent continues on this texture. I don’t dislike betting and checking is fine too.
Remember that we have absolute position here, and a delayed c-bet is also an option.
2-5 JTs Quote

      
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