LOL at not c-betting this flop. This is one of the nut flops to c-bet that doesn't hit our hand. We can double-barrel with equity on a ton of turn cards and it's going to be really hard for the majority of hands to call us down on this board.

"The concept of the continuation bet does not really apply in a multiway pot... I am going to find some reason other than my showing strength before the flop to determine whether or not I should bet."

Chris Ferguson, NLHE World Champion

Results will come in a few

So what cards are you barrelling? Any spade? Queens? Kings? 9s? You understand that a lot of the limp calling range(besides a King) also improves a lot of their holdings as well. Just seems bad vs 3 people to cbet this board. Vs 1 maybe 2 I would in a heartbeat but you better be willing to empty the clip, meaning triple barrell, for a cbet to be profitable here.

Any spade, any 9, any card J or higher. That's about half the deck. Against the described V I'm firing the third barrel pretty often as I don't expect him to have much of a calling range OTR unless he improves.

If the draws brick out we are targeting pretty much Tx exclusively on the river, correct? I don't 3 barrel very often but agreed it should be hard for Tx to call a river bet on a K or Q turn and/or river.

We'll probably occasionally run into Tx two pair that calls it off but I suppose "that's poker."

9 is a bad card as he has JT/QJ/J9 etc type of hands a lot and the 9 will improve him a ton.

J we should be checking back in order to get river value from bad Tx

Q Ya we can bet a Q, but a Q turn we definitely will have to empty the clip three times which im not the biggest of fans of in 1/2

K Is definitely the perfect card to barrel and we will again have to empty the clip.

A I would prefer a checkback on the turn as we are most likely only getting 2 streets from worse and I think we get more by checking back turn and betting largeish on the river

Spade: Clearly a good card to barrel, just depends on the spade though I think.

Also, there is a pretty good arguement as well for checking back because of the fact we would be able to profitably call a bet on the turn IF those cards came out. I am all for double barrelling at 1/2 but I generally do it Heads Up or 3 ways to the flop not 4 ways on this board, just seems like a variance bomb cbetting this when we have sooo many good backdoor cards for our hand + rarely getting folds 4 ways to the flop.

I like the c bet and sizing given we have chips to fire multiple barrels. V´s tank is kind of weird. Feels like some kind of marginal hand or alternately a big draw like 8xss that he was considering playing fast. I´m going to bet/fold 2/3+ and go for the gold vs QJ,J9,T9,98,combo draw type hands.

Does anyone like checking back turn?

Not I. Is he really checking a hand that beats us on the turn? Get him to call one more and don't give him a free card if he is drawing. If he folds, he folds.

The only way checking back the turn is good is if you think he is not drawing and he will call on river with a T. It might be a good way to get two streets, but I'd rather just continue my story and bet the turn (especially since the story just got better).

Well, I didn't think he was drawing due to the tank time....


And since my plan was to barrel him off hands like Tx, 8x, I think the second barrel would've done it on a scare card.
The only problem with this was that.... I actually now picked up TPTK...
So if I follow the flop plan, he will prob fold out Tx, 8x type hands that don't have 9 in them.

I checked back the turn.

River: Qo
V checks, hero checks behind.

V shows AQo, Hero mucks.

My plan was to bet brick-ish rivers for thin value against Tx, 8x that might just "put me on AK"

Wow, V is like the worst player ever.

Problem is, there aren't that many bricks. As stated, I would have just bet the turn. Yes, he would have folded, but that's OK. Turns out he was drawing and he got there Would have been OK if he folded a T or 8, too, but he might have called to see one more -- and most T or 8 hands are also drawing here. Make him pay.

Your description of the field and the V is throwing off the advice on how you should have played this hand. The V you described is a loose passive and is not tight. Also, the way you describe the field as more likely to get a string of callers preflop once somebody else calls is another indication of a loose passive table. It may be tighter than the typical loose-passive donk fest but it is still loose passive.

Because this table is so passive, you really don't need to be c-betting whiffed boards in multi-way pots. The fact that the guy called you OOP with AQ means that you can never bluff him since you'll never know where he is at in a hand.

Most of your money at this kind of table will be made by stealing from the weakish limpers pre-flop variance free. Once you see a flop, you should go for a street or two of value when you hit and just check/fold when you miss, since they are never betting unless they have you beat.

Over the course of a session, you will be printing money at a steady rate with very little variance. You really don't want to be playing bloated pots with marginal hands.

Somehow I doubt that. He's got a double gutshot and two overs now. And he's already shown he doesn't like to fold. Not that it really matters though.

Then he is worse than he seems.

If V is calling flop as light as AQ (without the A no less), then you should absolutely be c-betting with the intention of firing multiple barrels. Turn check back is a mistake:

A. Because we plan to barrel so many turns, we need to bet when we improve as well.
B. Because there are so many pair+draw hands on this board that you get value from with a turn bet (and also because giving those hands a free river is pretty bad).

It really is board dependant for firing multi bullets at this guy but in general if a guy is calling you this light then you should be going for value not trying to bluff at him.
This guy could literally only beat AJ on the flop and yet he still called that there is telling me a lot.
On the turn he has picked up a few draws nut even then they are not that great looking.
Dont try bluffing this guy just value bet jim to death and print the cash

Sorry, but this is just really, really wrong. In general, yes, you should mostly just be trying to value bet people to death at LLSNL. But when you start noticing a player floating flops OOP this light, you should instead punish them with multiple barrels, as they'll fold the majority of their range on the turn/river unless they improve (which they won't most of the time since they only have 2-6 outs in these spots).