10/20 5-handed, my image is not good because I just doubled up 2 of the players at the table.. never turned my cards over though. They are likely to perceive me turning up the aggression as being on tilt(I wasn't at all), but I was just doing what should be done when 5-handed with players who are either nitty-bad or loose-passive and not thinking past level 2 if not stuck on level 1... I'm not sure there's another winning player at the table fwiw.

UTG I pick up 34 raise to $80, BTN very tight player flats & both blinds call. SB $2,500 is mediocre pro calls too much kinda fit or fold.. BB $2,800 is bad old nit limp/calls too much OOP and very bad postflop calling station also makes nonsensical bets sometimes.

Flop ($320) Q34 SB/BB both c/c $260.

Turn ($840) 9

SB checks, BB donks $400, Hero...

I thought standard play here given stacks is to raise.. committing to calling it off right? Calling seems bad to me in so many ways.. folding this 5-handed is outta the question esp. given my image...

You can never fold here with your image, and calling gives SB great odds to call with a lot of his range. So yes, raising to gii is the only thing that really makes sense (assuming you cover both).

On a side note, even if it's 5-handed against mediocre/bad players, can we really make opening 43s utg profitable with our image? You're getting called a little wider even by the nittiest of nits imo.

raise/call not even close.

I agree about pre. if you're image sucks, then just play a little tighter and value bet them to death. no need to open 43s.

Ideal situation. I would raise big on the turn.

Raise big on the turn for sure given your image and the draws on board

-Twms1111

if my image sucks with villains not adjusting to shorthanded game, isn't it time to open wider pre, tighten up post but size all vbets larger? I mean that was my plan.

UTG = HJ in this case, and if you're opening mid-lower SCs in LP when folded to in a fullring game(given stacks deep enough etc etc) then why wouldn't you do it while short with nits in the blinds who won't 3b and play fit or fold postflop?

Rz to 1.1, hope for a brick riv to jam would be my standard but with your above read and image I quite like jamming turn unless if he's scared to call big bets gen as you can get the money in before perceived scare cards come off otr of which there are many.

fold pre, raise turn

+1 that pre is preeeetty bad.

i've been out of live for awhile...but i mean, at these stakes are even weak players donking half pot into two players and then calling it all off with less than bottom two or a monster draw? If so...i guess maybe jamming the turn is best, and i'm pretty stoked to be getting back into live next month

I'm in the raise turn camp as well, PF is w/e

I played some 10-20 this week with a few nits like described villain in bb and I agree with this now. Raising is probably bad

no. 34s doesn't do well enough in the long run against people who will call you and you will have no fold equity pre or on flop.

you're better off adjusting by tightening up your opening range and widen you're 3bet value range and 3 bet bluffing less often.

You can also value bet lighter and bluff less on every street post flop.

Agree with fold pf and easy raise turn.

+1 to fold pre and I don't think it's very close. I like bamboo's post.

Results please?

If you had a database of all the times you had a bad image and opened suited connectors UTG in a shorthanded game, I'd be VERY surprised if you were even close to profitable.

Focusing on pre, I'm going against the grain, which is fine. Opening with 34s is fine against a field of bad players. I would prefer stacks be somewhat deeper (4k+ would be optimal) but I'm never ever mucking this against the types of players you've mentioned. 5 handed means you are really the hijack.

On the turn, raise/gii. The hand I would be most afraid of from spazzy old dude would be some kinda weird slow play where they flop a monster and wait for a "safe card" on the turn before putting in more chips.

lol at everyone saying fold pre. I open this at a normal table in any position 5 handed, let alone a table where OP claims "I'm not sure there's another winning player at the table fwiw".

As played I'd raise turn almost always

I totally respect your play and advice. I'll play devil's advocate though.

Let's just assume under these conditions that we are seeing a flop almost a 100% of the time. So we will never win the blinds uncontested.

Let's also assume with our image and their station tendencies, that we can't profitably cbet bluff against this lineup. So, we are going to have to make a hand and win a lot of showdowns.

With these types of conditions, wouldn't it be better to just limp then? rather than raise and put more money into a pot pre where they are calling with better equity hands.

I'm not saying I'm right. I'm just curious to see how 34s is going to fair in a no fold'em hold'em game. where we are gonna have to get to showdown a lot in order to win pots.

Maybe my assumptions are just wrong and we can definitely just keep pounding these clowns with our terrible image and get folds, but I just don't think that will be the case.

1k posts, wheeeeeee

I think you're missing some of the important points in the OP. First, all opponents are "nitty-bad or loose-passive", we are good, so we're going to open wide and cbet vs nitty bad and make hands vs loose-passive and then take maney.

It's not necessarily no-foldem either, button is super tight according to OP so we just have to get through 1 to play in position vs loose stations.

Lastly you're putting too much into your image. We lost two big pots but we didn't show down hands and thus we didn't necessarily get out of line. I'm not saying image isn't important, it is, just that there is a difference between clearly getting out of line and getting caught doing it versus getting stacked a few times where our cards are unknown.

This is a 5 handed live game with bad players in it, we should be opening much wider in virtually every position.

Oh as for open limping, that's out of the question with any hand in any position at this table.

thanks for your reply. I think you're right about my assumptions being off from rereading description of villains.

I wouldn't even consider folding pre.

Those saying "raise big" I think are lacking the foresight of stack sizes. If you raise to say 1600 then BB will realize he only has 900 behind after calling and it will look strong since you're obviously committed. I'd either shove (because it looks more bluffy than a raise of 75% of eff. stacks) or raise to 1200 but I wouldn't be surprised if these "nits" fold Qx to either sizing.

If both guys behind are nits, you can open. If not, fold. Either way, 4x is a leak IMO.

As played, pretty read dependent. Is he bet/folding? Will he pay off a huge river bet if you flat now? Etc. But yeah, call or raise.