1/3 300 spread limit

I have just been moved to the main game about 2 orbits ago. I just squeezed and cbet took it down on the button vs V1's open and two calls. V1 folded to the squeeze and the cutoff who is young asian with another huge stack called twice preflop and folded a rainbow rag board on the flop

V1 - 30s to early 40s looking guy guy with 1000$ stack looks tagish in my 2 orbits or so has raised like 2 hands and isn't limping

V2 40s white guy (300$ stack) plays pretty tight passive

I open KQo UTG to 15 with 600 stack V1 calls in mp V2 calls cutoff

This is the borderline hand for UTG opening range but I think its good at a 1/3 table where I don't expect to get 3 bet light.

Flop Q J 9 rainbow (45)

Hero?

I go $20 pre UTG 333 BB eff. with V1 w/ my entire range but w/e

I would b/f $55 on this texture mutiway at 1/3. c/eval at 2/5+

I fold KQo in EP. If the game is playing deep (like most are $600 effective like we are) then I could see more reason for continuing preflop as we'll have lots of postflop play left, but with shorter stacks at a full table OOP it's pretty meh, imo. We created an SPR of ~6 against the short stack (and 100bbs can play very short at big raise / multiple caller tables), which is very awkward OOP.

I probably check the flop. If we bet and anyone starts wanting to pile in money we pretty much hate life. At this point we have a showdownable hand which is cool having a street check thru for pot control, underrepping our hand OOP, cool with being able to take a free card to hit our straight, and meanwhile we're not necessarily ahead on this board.

ETA: Unlike RoadToPro, I'm not as keen at bet/folding when I have a draw (albeit a slimmish one) to a good hand, which is why I think getting raised is a disaster and we should attempt to avoid that.

GbutI'mpassivelikethatG

Fold pre; $35 otf.

I think betting and checking this flop are pretty close. We certainly can get value from worse but OOP sucks 3-way on this board texture and various runouts.

C/eval gives a lot of flexibility depending on action behind. Can also confidently bet safe turns for value if it checks through as this is not a 3 street value proposition here unimproved.

+1

I'm curios what range you're opening 7x UTG at this depth. Does it really include KQo?

I think opening is fine given the table dynamic, maybe 6X from UTG.

X/C flop OOP and hope to realize our equity. This is not a multi-street value spot. If betting, likely folding, especially to V2.

^^^^^What table dynamic?

UTG: 77s+, AJs+, A10o+, KQo+, 65s+, J9s+.

***A huge caveat is that I typically play in unraked games ($10-15/hr time charge) which incentivizes me to widen my ranges preflop. This is obviously because I pay the same amount in fees whether I win 0 pots an hour or 5. In LA that would be a $35+ difference in rake paid.

But since most people don't factor in the rake into their overall strategy I ignore it as an consideration.

I'm going 7x with my entire range because we're OOP and 333 BB eff. with a "tagish" player

Just to clarify I have only 600$ so we are 200 bb effective with V1, 100 bb effective with V2

My bad, I didn't see our stack anywhere so I just assumed we covered

Rake, table dynamics, stack size and 3b frequencies aside.... opening this wide UTG to 7x will narrow calling ranges down so much that we will end up a range v range dog, oop and probably facing an spr <5 with some opponents, often even smaller.It doesn't matter how deep we are with some of the players if the average stack is around 100bb.

I truly believe opening like this is a leak for almost any player.

lolz if only it worked like that

Little or no 3-betting.

Could be oversight, but it seems OP didn't specify how many players are seated which matters quite a lot.

For me KQo fits within an UTG 6 max/MP full ring range. Would snap fold UTG with 8 or more players.

Definitely. Every single bolded hand should be folded UTG unless it's an OMC infested game.

This is top notch posting. It's both well written and full of good insight. I especially like the part where you restate the main point of my post, and then use facts, math and range construction to refute what I said.

Maybe if you accepted you were making mistakes, you could improve? Like did you notice your range has you folding ATs- but opening J9s and ATo?

I like having a depolarized (merged) range. My range probably has better board coverage than yours.

It seems to work well for me and translates well to higher stakes games. YMMV

At 100-200bb eff avg for the table, I'll take the equity advantage my range has vs your board coverage every day.

Also this is 300 spread limit

Lol oops I meant ATs+, AJo+.

Dude do w/e you want. I don’t care

I was just answering your question, If you don’t agree with my answer that’s fine

Board coverage definitely doesn't matter at LLSNL. I've never seen a chart suggest opening as wide as you are UTG. It's been a while since I've looked at one, but I remember the Upswing one being pretty wide, but it was also for something like 2x-3x opens for online play.

Opening hands like suited connectors, suited gappers, and KQo is definitely a leak and will be less profitable than just folding them. My go to UTG range is 88+, all suited broadways except JTs, QTs, and KTs, and then AQo+. Just because something has worked over a small sample size doesn't mean it's the best way to play.

Sixsevenoff, I don’t disagree with you, but you’re oversimplifying things. Currently, my main games are a variety of different un-raked games in a small/medium sized player pool. There are no casinos in Texas (except a few Indian ones) so I don’t have a choice. While I’ve played 1/2-2/5 several times at 18+ casinos and have consistently crushed, it’s not my main game so sure it’s over a small sample size.

Anyways, I think it’s important to give action and be good for the game, especially when you’re playing with the same people. If anything, even if particular lines are -EV, they seem to help me get paid for stacks when I make great hands, despite their not being a quantifiable correlation. The difference in EV between opening 77s and 88s UTG once you view it from that perspective is largely irrelevant.

The stakes aren’t really important because it’s not a casino and buyins are sometimes uncapped. It’s typically considerably more difficult than the casino equivalent because there’s drastically less fish in the pool but I’d agree that the games are still extremely juicy if you’re good enough. There are a few pros (full time players?) that play a variety of stakes as well, even “1/2”, which doesn’t happen in areas with large player pools.

While I’m obviously looking to get better, (very much so) It’s not really important to me that you guys agree with my preflop ranges. I understand the disadvantages to opening too wide lol. I was just telling the guy what my UTG range was and why you have to consider all the variables when utilizing them.

Whether or not it’s advisable for OP to widen his ranges is a different story but if everyone’s advice and style were the same, what’s the point? He can choose what strategies he wants to implement into his game and it can’t hurt to have different perspectives.

Look at Dwan’s ranges on PAD and HSP. Nobody was telling him that we was out of line? I’m not comparing myself to him but I plan to be in a similar spot within the next five years and crush those games for a living— and I’m preparing myself for when the opportunity presents itself. Your goals and strategy may be different and that’s fine man.

I think this board smacks calling ranges very hard and especially because I expect V2 to play pretty face up I think checking whole range is best on this board. Most hands I could get value from have very robust equity and as posters have mentioned this is a 2 street hand at most here so I think checking flop is the best line. We really are hoping it checks around and we get a brick where we can safely value bet.

Unfortunately I checked and V1 checked and V2 bet 40$. Hero?

Folding is silly, raising is an overplay. That leaves calling

I don’t think folding is that silly. We are facing a PSB from a tight passive player in a 3-way pot without closing the action. Seems weak-tight to C/F TP2K after raising pre but what is a tight passive player realistically betting here that we beat? QT? TT?

I think we see mostly AQ/KT/JJ/99/QJ/J9s/T8s

If his range includes all of this how does calling OOP look? Raising?