*Just sat at table, no info but HJ looks solid and UTG looks donk, later figured HJ is a donk as well*

(UTG EFS - 150)
(Hero EFS - 340)
(HJ EFS - 370)

Hero on SB with 7c9c
UTG limps
HJ raises to 16
CO calls, Hero calls, UTG calls
Flop is 8c6cKs
UTG donk bets 50
HJ raises to 175
Hero ??? Debating between call and shove, but if you think it might be a fold, I'll listen

Thought process is that the hand is too strong to fold and HJ has some fold equity cause my play will be so strong cause I’m repping a set. I’m ahead against AA and anything less. I’m only behind to KK, 88, 66.

As said in your first thread, please stop including results. They bias advice.

Fold pre. Suited gappers can be good hands, but not OOP in a pot raised to over 5BBs.

AP, we are never, ever, folding an OESFD. Generally, I prefer to GII early with semi-bluff while equity is high, but in this case HJ is prob never folding and UTG might come along if you flat.

Oh my bad! Still getting the hang of this haha.


If I was in position would it be a call preflop? Also what about SC’s like 67s, 78s, 89s would it be a call pre?

Fold pre

All SCs are folds from the SB. Position matters a lot.

IP, they can be calls, but I'd prefer the actual connectors to the gappers, and I'd prefer to call if the raise were smaller or there were at least two callers before me.

Yes

And u also would like some stack depth as well.
The power of a suited connector is making a straight or a flush, and it won’t happen too often. So u want to be able to win a lot when u do hit your big hand.
So u want like 80bb or more for a 4x raise pre, and as the raise size gets bigger, u need more stack depth as well.
The other strength of a suited connector is if u can get heads up with an opponent in position, and u can navigate well post flop. Especially if u have a good read on them.
For ex u might flat the 67cc in position vs a guy who u know over cbets, but doesn’t fire the second barrel unless he has it.
This is a great spot to peel one on the K84 flop,
If he checks the turn u can bet and take it away, and if he double barrels the turn, then u get his whole stack of it turns a 5, and u just dump it right there otherwise.

One pitfall to avoid is baby suited connectors when u get over 200bb deep, since u now run the risk of reverse implied odds: when u make a baby straight or a baby flush and your opponent has the higher one.

Postflop is exactly why we should be folding this pre OOP. (For what it's worth, I'd happily call here OTB.)

AP, you forget that you're also behind all higher flush draws. It sucks that the K isn't a club, so there are a fair number of pair+flush draws that have you crushed.

That being said, I would *hate* calling here. We need to see both cards to realize our equity, and if UTG is fishy he can easily have something like AK here. So I rip it and hope neither of them have a flush draw.

If we think either UTG or HJ are capable of taking this line with a flush draw (I doubt they are), just fold.

Preflop is a real easy fold for me. We're OOP to whom we suspect (at the time) is a solid player with a poor hand in what might not be a very multiway pot (and I don't think we even want multiway pots with this hand due to it's RIO).

I'm check/shoving the flop, even to this action. The raiser can easily feel committed against the shortstack donker, so he doesn't just need KK to do this. We might not have the greatest FE against 2 opponents, but we still have a little bit, and adding that to our actual equity will likely make a shove here decently profitable. I haven't done the math on whether calling enables us to also call a turn shove if we whiff, but we really want to see all 5 cards here plus add our little FE, so I favour the shove.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Unless you're a crushing winner in your game, my guess is that these hands are the most overrated in poker. They have very high RIO (if you make a strong hand and someone else makes a strong enough hand to put in big chips postflop against it, there is simply too good a chance they've made a bigger hand, such as a bigger flush / bigger straight / bigger kicker with their trips / bigger two pair / etc.). There's more argument for playing them in position (which will help us avoid the RIO pitfalls) but overall I would only be playing them multiway in limped high SPR pots where I can use my position/skill to figure out what is going on over 3 postflop streets. I never play them in multiway raised pots (where we won't have the streets to figure out what is going on, even with position).

GimoG

Lol 98s is like the worst one vs UTG smh u lose it all to AK on QJT if u want the best one it gives u coverage on boards he misses like 67s/56s/etc vs UTG