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1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised 1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised

04-11-2012 , 02:47 PM
In a straddled pot I raise a limper w/JTo in lp to 16, bb, straddler, limper call.

Pot is 61

Flop 9c 9s 7c

bb checks, straddler checks, ep limper checks, I bet 50, bb raises to 100, folds to me I...

Since moving to this table I've opened quite a few pots and have lost around $90 in an hr or so. Villain is a middle aged very loose/passive player that I've played maybe a total of 2 hrs with. He has about ~900 in front we have roughly 250. Are stacks really bad to shove over a perceived range of JJ-22 7x, I think JJ, TT never fold?

If I shove the pot will be big and the big stack might decide to call since the pot has gotten so big. If I shove the pot will be ~400 and hell have to call about 200.

So do I shove, fold, or call?
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 03:02 PM
First, id raise to 20ish preflop, not a big deal, but just saying. Second, your perceived range is totally wrong. Why is he check raising a pair of 7s or 22? IF he were to bet it, he would bet out. The guy has a 9 80% of the time (and he is doing spewy weird fish stuff the other 20%). So you have 4 outs more often than not. This is an easy fold.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 03:47 PM
Yeah if you had a better draw this might get interesting, but as is you must fold. He most likely has a 9, and the most common 9 hands are 9T, 98, 9A followed by 9J and 97. If he has 97 or 98 you are dead to runners, and any other 9 you need to hit your gutshot against and hope he doesn't fill up.

Heck, you may even find yourself getting looked up by Ax clubs and losing to high card.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 03:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by luigijerk
Yeah if you had a better draw this might get interesting, but as is you must fold. He most likely has a 9, and the most common 9 hands are 9T, 98, 9A followed by 9J and 97. If he has 97 or 98 you are dead to runners, and any other 9 you need to hit your gutshot against and hope he doesn't fill up.

Heck, you may even find yourself getting looked up by Ax clubs and losing to high card.
+1
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 04:26 PM
Actually I'd take 22-44 out of his range, I definitely could see this being a "find out where I'm at" raise.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by luigijerk
Yeah if you had a better draw this might get interesting, but as is you must fold. He most likely has a 9, and the most common 9 hands are 9T, 98, 9A followed by 9J and 97. If he has 97 or 98 you are dead to runners, and any other 9 you need to hit your gutshot against and hope he doesn't fill up.

Heck, you may even find yourself getting looked up by Ax clubs and losing to high card.
Just fold.

When a very loose/passive player wakes up and minraises you on a paired board, it's time to get out of the hand.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 04:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeuceSeven
Actually I'd take 22-44 out of his range, I definitely could see this being a "find out where I'm at" raise.
That's pretty bad given stack sizes. It's bad enough to raise to find out where I am at.

Fold all day, and also I think you could make this $30 ish OTF and accomplish the same thing.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 04:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcePlayerDeluxe
Fold all day, and also I think you could make this $30 ish OTF and accomplish the same thing.
This is an important point. You can conserve chips for the same information. These kinds of considerations add up.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 04:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcePlayerDeluxe
That's pretty bad given stack sizes. It's bad enough to raise to find out where I am at.

Fold all day, and also I think you could make this $30 ish OTF and accomplish the same thing.
This is something I'm working to shore up. I did in fact fold. I thought that even if he's "raising to find out where he's at" he might just feel pot stuck + having a big stack my fe was close to 0.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 05:22 PM
Fold

Your hand could already be drawing dead to 9/7, 77
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-11-2012 , 11:51 PM
Easy fold as played. Im tempted to peel a free one if i have a club maybe even neways depending on the 3 villains
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-12-2012 , 02:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomark
First, id raise to 20ish preflop, not a big deal, but just saying. Second, your perceived range is totally wrong. Why is he check raising a pair of 7s or 22? IF he were to bet it, he would bet out. The guy has a 9 80% of the time (and he is doing spewy weird fish stuff the other 20%). So you have 4 outs more often than not. This is an easy fold.
+1

Also, in future...don't cbet a board like this when on its 4 handed and you're on air...
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-12-2012 , 02:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LotGrinder
+1

Also, in future...don't cbet a board like this when on its 4 handed and you're on air...
Seems like 2 overs and a gutter w/some fe when a bigger card hits ott or otr is enough for me. I'd check if I didn't have the gutter.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-12-2012 , 04:12 AM
I think this is a good flop to bet. What is calling? Obviously 9... a 7 or PP might call, but also might just fold, but wont stick around if you find a second barrel on the turn or river. and then T8/86...
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-12-2012 , 12:54 PM
I'd rather take a free card w a delayed Cbet...

To each their own...
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote
04-12-2012 , 01:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LotGrinder
I'd rather take a free card w a delayed Cbet...

To each their own...
I don't think checking is bad either and it might be better. I just get way too much credit from the other players.
1/2nl 2 overs + gutshot gets minraised Quote

      
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