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1/2 TT on draw heavy board 1/2 TT on draw heavy board

10-25-2013 , 04:24 PM
V1 (200)- 30 yo white male, drunk, said he thought about bluffing me off the previous hand
Hero's Image (190)- 25 yo white male, tag

Preflop (3):
Hero is BTN dealt TT
1 limps, Hero raise to 10, V1 calls from SB, limped folds.

Flop (21):
J73
Checks through.

Turn (21)
4
V1 bets 16, Hero calls.

River (51):
Q
V1 bets 40, Hero calls.

I asked him "will you show if I fold?" He says he will. I tank a bit and he offer to show again. I thought that the bet was a little too big to be a value bet and a lot of draws missed.

Last edited by AcePlayerDeluxe; 10-25-2013 at 11:22 PM.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 04:37 PM
Cbet flop
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 04:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLikeCaliDonks
Cbet flop
I don't think villain has a hand he can call with. He isn't a station, I would cbet here vs a station. I believe he is more likely to bluff with air than call down with a weak hand.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 04:52 PM
Sure, but you can still c-bet flop, have him call a wide range, and value check scary turns (or value bet turn and check behind river).

I'd be more inclined to bluff-induce if the board is bone dry or ace-high
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 04:53 PM
Standard ****ty spot against a drunk. I'd c-bet $15 and check the turn and river unimproved hoping to get a cheap showdown (but knowing it's not happening). I'd be more apt to check this flop OOP.

As played I fold without a solid tell. He's repping a pretty narrow value range here and his talk makes me curious but I hate calling off in this spot and being shown QJ or a flush. If you believe that he'll show if you fold you'll get solid info without having to pay $40. If he then doesn't, I'm pretty sure he has it, drunks love to show bluffs.

Seat change!
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 04:54 PM
When you are a tight player bluff catching shouldn't be something you do often.

You have to analyze board texture. Your range vs his flop calling range. His range is at mercy vs your range ott when looking at future turn cards. Like A/K scare cards and flush completing turns. When you give up its a guessing game. We don't have to play like that in position. We can double 10/10 but its not for value. Its to get his weak flop calling range to fold ott. You have to notice spots like this when you play tight.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 04:56 PM
One other little nugget, after he bet the turn he said "I have a good hand", I call and say "I have outs"
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 05:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLikeCaliDonks
When you are a tight player bluff catching shouldn't be something you do often.

You have to analyze board texture. Your range vs his flop calling range. His range is at mercy vs your range ott when looking at future turn cards. Like A/K scare cards and flush completing turns. When you give up its a guessing game. We don't have to play like that in position. We can double 10/10 but its not for value. Its to get his weak flop calling range to fold ott. You have to notice spots like this when you play tight.
It is uncommon for me to bluff catch but I felt this spot was appropriate and I had a read. I don't think his flop calling range is weak, he probably won't call w/o a J or fd. I don't want to fold out weaker hands I want him to put in more money with them and the only way to do that is to get him rope to bluff with.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 05:06 PM
An J or a fd is weak vs your perceived range. You have to add that variable to your decision.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 05:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pure_aggression
It is uncommon for me to bluff catch but I felt this spot was appropriate and I had a read. I don't think his flop calling range is weak, he probably won't call w/o a J or fd. I don't want to fold out weaker hands I want him to put in more money with them and the only way to do that is to get him rope to bluff with.
Trust your reads.

I understand the reasoning here but if you're planning on giving him rope to hang himself I'd rather do it with a hand like AJ/KJ. You'll find yourself in a spot like this too often when you're guessing if you're good or not OTR. I also think his calling range is wider than you give him credit for if you c-bet flop. I'm guessing 88, 99, 87 and 76 all call one street.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 05:26 PM
Have to c-bet flop so you can control the future streets
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 05:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLikeCaliDonks
An J or a fd is weak vs your perceived range. You have to add that variable to your decision.
I don't think he is going to automatically give me credit for QQ+ here. There are very few hands that are better than TT that will fold so there is very little value in turning my hand into a bluff.
There are far more hands that are worse that will bluff, he already told be he wanted to bluff me so I know he is itching to pull the trigger when I show weakness.

Thanks for the input, I appreciate it even if we don't agree.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 3 Bullits
Trust your reads.

I understand the reasoning here but if you're planning on giving him rope to hang himself I'd rather do it with a hand like AJ/KJ. You'll find yourself in a spot like this too often when you're guessing if you're good or not OTR. I also think his calling range is wider than you give him credit for if you c-bet flop. I'm guessing 88, 99, 87 and 76 all call one street.
I don't think there is much difference between me holding KJ+ and taking a passive line and TT besides a few more overs that my hand in venerable to.

I don't mind cbetting IP vs people I know peel wide but I had seen thatvthis villain had a fold button.

Thanks for the comments all. I'll post results tomorrow.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 09:57 PM
Once you get to that river, there's no way I'm folding to that bet.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 10:04 PM
Just noticed turn should be 4 not 4
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 10:26 PM
I like it.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 10:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLikeCaliDonks
When you are a tight player bluff catching shouldn't be something you do often.

You have to analyze board texture. Your range vs his flop calling range. His range is at mercy vs your range ott when looking at future turn cards. Like A/K scare cards and flush completing turns. When you give up its a guessing game. We don't have to play like that in position. We can double 10/10 but its not for value. Its to get his weak flop calling range to fold ott. You have to notice spots like this when you play tight.
Lol.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-25-2013 , 11:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pure_aggression
Just noticed turn should be 4 not 4
That changes it from a "no way i'm folding" to "i'm probably not folding".
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-26-2013 , 12:55 AM
Sabr would laugh at me. Everyone can't play your style of game bankroll requirements obviously. In llsnl they barely bluff so calling down with 2nd now 3rd pair is not a normal play for a tight players bankroll period!
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-26-2013 , 01:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pure_aggression
Just noticed turn should be 4 not 4
Calling now. Way less value hands in his range and doubt he's good enough to merge Jx here.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-26-2013 , 01:59 AM
I can't see how you're ahead here. You beat a 7, 4, or 3 ONLY. You have third pair on a busted flush board.

Curiousity has the best of me.. what did he have?
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-26-2013 , 02:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pure_aggression
One other little nugget, after he bet the turn he said "I have a good hand", I call and say "I have outs"
This is weakness from my experience playing live. If he truly had a great hand he would not want to scare you aware from putting your money into the pot with a worse hand. He's actually saying this because he doesn't want to get raised and/or not get put into a tough spot on the river having to invest more money into the pot to win with his marginal holding. Also, he might be afraid of certain river cards. I bet since he said this he had top pair with a weak kicker and no redraw.

My guess is he had some type of J8 black offsuit rag type of hand?
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-26-2013 , 03:08 AM
There's nothing wrong with checking the flop. It can sometimes be a good way to induce action from the weak part of the guy's range, which is most of it.

I think the river call is good since he's basically only representing nut hands and it's a blind vs. button situation.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-26-2013 , 01:23 PM
Spoiler:
I toss in the calling chips, villain turbo mucks before I even flip my hand over.
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-26-2013 , 02:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLikeCaliDonks
When you are a tight player bluff catching shouldn't be something you do often.

You have to analyze board texture. Your range vs his flop calling range. His range is at mercy vs your range ott when looking at future turn cards. Like A/K scare cards and flush completing turns. When you give up its a guessing game. We don't have to play like that in position. We can double 10/10 but its not for value. Its to get his weak flop calling range to fold ott. You have to notice spots like this when you play tight.
Lol
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote
10-26-2013 , 02:02 PM
Snap call! $$$
1/2 TT on draw heavy board Quote

      
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