Loose-passive table, typical 4-5 players to flop, general open $8-12.

UTG limps, UTG+1 folds to Hero UTG+2 who limps 1010, MP limps, CO limps, Button raises to 6, blinds+limpers call.

Flop: ($42) 1087

SB leads for $8, BB calls, UTG+1 calls,

Hero makes it $65 to go.

Thoughts on preflop limp/call?

What about flop bet-sizing?

Your stack size would help along with any others you remember. At least estimates.

I would raise pf probably to $12 rather than limp or maybe once you limp try raising afterwards. Not many are making it $6 to go pf w/ JJ+ so I think its safe to say you are ahead in most cases. As played i would say your raise is very big otf and you are only getting called or raised by sets and straights depending on effective stacks... Edit with stack sizes and you can get some solid advice from someone im sure.

I think you did OK.

I would never limp unless I was at an aggro table planning to reraise. You vcan get value from lesser sets and hell itsd 1 2 live you're gonna get called by most players with 2 pair. The only hands that beat you are jack 9 and and 6 9. Bottom line you have top set at a 1 2 live game. Get it all in, if you lose its a cooler.

Pre I actually think limping with 10s in EP against loose passives is ok. But if your going to raise make it 12+. I'd usually raise with it but limping is really solid too.

I would make it $45 to go on flop. You get some 2 pairs to call/ sets and straights will stack. If you make it so much, I would almost question whether you are even ahead since you are weeding out a little too much. If stacks are <100 BB, its a snap call over a shove. Its still a cooler even with a small $6 raise.

Eff stacks were about 75 due to a shortie, but the Villain who led flop from SB was at 700, Hero 375, all others at more or less 200.

I don't think a limp is horrendous but I think a raise to anywhere from 6 to 12 is better depending on whether you want to play it like a big pair or set mine. I think the flop raise is fine, I might make it a little smaller, and I'm happy to stack off with anyone with 100bb with top set. I'd stack off with the deeper guy with your 188bb, but I wouldn't be as excited about it.

Not a big fan of the limp, just raise yourself, rest is fine.

Initially I was limp-calling to set-mine as I'd seen several players stack off *super light* - with TPBK, or trips on a four flush board, or two garbage pair with a possible straight, etc. etc.

However once I hit the set, with this gross of a board I figured I didn't want to see a turn card - and these players had been snap calling 2/3 to 3/4 pot bets all night with mid-pair or any draw (gutshots, too), hence the relatively large pot bet.

Do we ever want to see a turn? With Villain's best draw (Ac9c), I'm slightly under 60/40 here.

You always want to see a turn as long as you are not giving villain proper odds to see a turn. This goes with the thinking of betting "to get people off their draws" rather than making them pay improper odds to hit their draws. If you didn't want to see a turn, you should just shove here (and I've seen many live donks do that every time they have the nuts or close to it).

Pre flop is fine. UTG +2 with 10s is not an auto raise if you are getting tons of callers. There is barely any dead money, we hate virtually every flop and have to play it OOP and in good games we can still get the pot plenty big when we hit our set. Oh and it suck the rare times we get three bet.

On the flop just mash the pot button and get in the monies against all kinds of crap villains will never fold. EZ GAME. s

And yes we want to see a turn, but only after we get lots of villains only after we get lots of villains money in the pot when they have bad equity.

So how big does the disparity between "good price" and "bad price" to draw have to be in order to make it a +EV bet?

For instance, in this situation if I'm 60/40 against one of Villain's theoretically strongest draws (NFD+OESD), is giving Villain 1.6:1 vs. 1.5:1 more correct than 2:1 or 3:1 as we're saving $$$ in the long-term when we're on the losing side of Villain's call?

In the case of the above hand pot is ~$65 so $38 gives Villain slightly worse than the 1.5:1 odds he needs to continue.

When sizing, go for the biggest amount you think opponent will call with worse hands. That is optimal.

What are the stack sizes?

Generally speaking you'll want to raise TT preflop, but it's hard to give more comments than that without knowing how deep the game is playing.

Limped pot, $8 bet and you raise to $65? I understand the pot had about that...but that's a huge raise. You're blasting everyone off their hands unless they have a set or a straight. Make it like $40 and hope you get a caller. Assuming Ac9c is the only hand someone can call with is nuts. Sure, you may have to slow down on the turn if a jack hits, but that's poker.

Now if you think someone will call $65 with a pair or 9 here, good bet. I'd be very hard pressed to find anyone who can call this bet without a monster and think you bet entirely too much.

Your odds r wrong because although they could be 35% to winthe hand, you aren't gonna be checking a good turn.

I'm guessing preflop is whatever so long as we don't fold. If the table is quite tight and there's a good chance we can a limper, then I'm more for raising; otherwise, I'm cool with limping these middling pocket pair hands.

This is a very draw heavy board, so I usually like offering the first guy fairly poor odds of 2:1, so I'd raise to ~$82ish. Realize that if we offer the first guy fairly decent odds of 3:1, then the next guy is getting great odds (almost the immediate odds he needs to chase a draw) of 4:1. There's three people in the pot, one of these suckers is going to call, so let's make it expensive for them.

ETA: I'm not sure why some think OPs flop raise was too large; if anything, it was too small, IMO. First guy bet $8 into a $42 pot, lol, we might as well take that as a check. By the time it gets to us there's $66 in the pot with 3 interested opponents on the world's most drawy board; anything less than a PSB is pretty bad, methinks. If we bet $40ish as some have suggested that makes the pot $106ish; the first guy is already getting well over 3:1 to call, let alone the next guys.

GcluelessNLnoobG

ETA: I'm not sure why some think OPs flop raise was too large; if anything, it was too small, IMO. First guy bet $8 into a $42 pot, lol, we might as well take that as a check. By the time it gets to us there's $66 in the pot with 3 interested opponents on the world's most drawy board; anything less than a PSB is pretty bad, methinks. If we bet $40ish as some have suggested that makes the pot $106ish; the first guy is already getting well over 3:1 to call, let alone the next guys.

GcluelessNLnoobG[/QUOTE]

You are kind of contradicting yourself here. If you are considering that $8 bet to basically be a check, then there are only two other interested people in the pot, and seemingly none of them had a good enough hand to raise the flop themselves with, so just how interested is up for debate. If you make it 60 you are most likely getting folds, if you make it 80 you definitely are.