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1/2 NL- tough spot with straight 1/2 NL- tough spot with straight

09-04-2010 , 02:15 PM
I had sat down at the table for at least 2 hours, table is very loose passive. Most players limp preflop. My image is tight. Villian is a good player, very aggressive post-flop, but has shown down strong hands so far and is on an incredible rush. He has been hitting hands for big pots and hasn’t lost a pot within the last hour or so. He appears to be very knowledgeable of the game based on the way he discusses hands. I had lost a hand to him in the last hour, approximately $ 80. I folded my hand to his pot sized bet on the turn and he says “good fold“, shows me a turned full house.

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Hero (Button) - nearly $ 300 in front of me.
Villian ( UTG) - his stack approximately $ 640

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Villian limps preflops, nearly everybody limps along with him except for a few people . I have a non suited J 10 on the button and I call. Small blind completes big blind bet and big blind checks. $ 12 now in the pot.

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Flop comes K Q 6 rainbow.
Both blinds checked, Villian checks, everybody checks to me. I check as well.

I figured I would like to see a free card and see if I hit my straight and hopefully someone catches something as well.

Pot is still $ 12.

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Turn comes a 9. Does not make any flush draws available at this point.

Both blinds checked, Villian bets $ 20. Everybody folds to me. I decide to call his $20 bet. The blinds fold.

I figured I would try to be tricky with my turned straight and make him think I was on some type of straight draw.

Pot is now $52.

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River comes a K. Does not complete any flush draws but it does pair the board.

Villian bets $ 30. I did not think the K helped him in any way based on the way the hand played out so I decided to raise to $ 75 with my straight. Villian says “really, did you make your hand? ”. He thinks for about 30 seconds and announces a reraise and raises an additional $ 100 on top.

Pot is now $ 302.

He has me covered obviously. I have around $200 left in front of me. What should I do here?

How did I play this hand? Any comments appreciated. Thanks.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-04-2010 , 02:24 PM
there's no way villian has KQ. K6 or K9 are possible for him to limp... especially K9. also, 99 or 66 are possible. i think he shows up here with K-rag here a good amount of the time. getting 3/1 on the call, i make the call.

ps: raise turn to at least $50... more like $65-$75
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-04-2010 , 02:28 PM
I would have raised the turn, it is so easy to make 2 pairs on limp pots that i feel you are missing value by not raising, me might even have trips. I fold river because it is easy for him to have a FH.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-04-2010 , 02:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by natureboy
He appears to be very knowledgeable of the game based on the way he discusses hands.
If he knew WTF he was doing, he wouldn't be discussing hands or strategy at the table.

Iso raise pre

Bet the flop

Raise turn for value

If you had played the hand correctly there would be no reason to raise the river, we could simply call his river bet and if we are ahead great, if not it happens.

You didn't build a pot pre, flop, or turn and you should have. Now you waited until the board pairs on the river and you make a thin value raise and have no idea what to do when he raises.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-04-2010 , 02:48 PM
Villain checks flop OOP to the pre-flop raiser and then donks the turn with Hero calling.

Villain donks river and Hero raises, Villain gives us a speech and re-raises Hero.

We have the nut-straight, but the board is paired, with a K. We can beat AK and are crushed by KQ.

Villain probably does not have JT in our pre-flop raise range, but may have us on AK given the speech.

We know that Villain has a K in is hand, knowing this Hero raises for value with his straight and Villain re-raises with his K as to be expected really.

Bad River raise, as MercuryPoison said we are lost now and likely being value-towned. Villain puts 1/2 our remaining stack in offering us 3:1 on a call.

Last edited by Sebastes Pinneger; 09-04-2010 at 03:02 PM. Reason: Thoughts on Villains raise sizing
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-04-2010 , 08:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastes Pinneger
Villain checks flop OOP to the pre-flop raiser and then donks the turn with Hero calling.

Villain probably does not have JT in our pre-flop raise range, but may have us on AK given the speech..
Their was no raise pf by hero. This is a limped pot.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-04-2010 , 09:03 PM
Very unlikely villain at this level takes a bet/3 bet line on the river with a non-nut hand. Best case scenario were chopping but most likely villian has a boat probably 9s full IMO.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-05-2010 , 10:58 AM
When giving that speech "have you made your hand?" and a raise follows, it's the nuts. He should be worried about you having at least Kx himself. Why isn't he...?
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-05-2010 , 06:09 PM
Call the $100, live with the result.

In the future, raise the turn.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-05-2010 , 06:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryPoison
If he knew WTF he was doing, he wouldn't be discussing hands or strategy at the table.

Iso raise pre

Bet the flop

Raise turn for value

If you had played the hand correctly there would be no reason to raise the river, we could simply call his river bet and if we are ahead great, if not it happens.

You didn't build a pot pre, flop, or turn and you should have. Now you waited until the board pairs on the river and you make a thin value raise and have no idea what to do when he raises.
+1

As played the river raise was your biggest mistake. Just call when the board pairs on the river.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-05-2010 , 11:41 PM
Calculate your pot equity and compare that to your pot odds to determine whether or not to call this river bet.

His range: 66, 99, K9, KQ, KJ, K10.

Of these, and given the known cards, there are 3 possible combinations of 66 and 3 combinations of 99. There are 6 combinations each for K9, KQ, KJ, and K10. There are thirty possible hand combinations, of which you win against 12 of them (KJ and K10).

Thus, your pot equity is 12/30 or 40%, meaning you should call if you're getting 1.5-to-1 or better on your pot odds. Since you're getting 3-to-1, this is an easy call on the river.

However, you made several mistakes throughout the hand that made this a tougher hand than it should have been.

First though, I like your call preflop - you have good implied odds and want many opponents in the hand - ISO'ing here is stupid, IMO, with such a weak hand like J10.

However, I'd make a 1/3rd or 1/2 bet on flop to help build it up, entice callers, and improve your implied odds.

Raise turn.

As mercury pointed out, if you played it correctly, there'd be no reason to raise the river. However, as played, I like your river raise against his possible range.

P.S. J10 is also in his range, but forgot to include it in calculation: It shouldn't change much tho.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-06-2010 , 07:44 PM
It was a very hard decision, it actually took me almost 1 1/2 minutes to make my decision. I really considered folding my hand but I called based on the pot odds offered . Villian shows K Q. I misplayed this entire hand. Thank you guys for your responses.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-08-2010 , 03:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercuryPoison
Iso raise pre
I'm assuming you misread the OP. Villain wasn't the only one that limped, it looks like an almost family limped pot. Calling with a meh hand on the button for one bet in a family pot looks fine to me.

I raise the turn like 100% of the time here. Lottsa picture cards on board, villain could easily have two pair, we have the nuts, I'm looking to build a pot and I can't do that by calling.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-08-2010 , 04:24 PM
Raise turn, flat river as played. He has it a lot, but "it" may be something you beat enough to make a pot odds call fairly easily.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-08-2010 , 04:39 PM
IMO raising preflop here is spew.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2OutsNoProb
Call the $100, live with the result.

In the future, raise the turn.
this
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote
09-08-2010 , 06:18 PM
To me there's a good chance villain has the same hand as hero. He bet $20 into a $12 pot on the turn. I do not like raising in this spot, it pretty much turns my hand face up. Against fish I would make a value raise, but against described opponent, I prefer smooth calling. The river bet is fairly small, I don't like your raise at all, too small looks like it is begging for a call, you also sort of telegraphed you do not have a nut hand. I like a strong raise to $90 at least, you may even make him fold J10. This way, if he comes over the top, it is fairly certain you are beat, and when you make a strong river raise in the future with nut hands, people may look you up more often.

I also bet the flop, OE straight draw in position is just about as good a spot to be in NL holdem, betting $10 is what I would do. As played fold river.
1/2 NL- tough spot with straight Quote

      
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