Hero is button with two kings. Old man is BB. He had been doing a crossword puzzle and not paying much attention, so when he comes into the hand, I figure him for something. Other villain is a good player...fairly aggressive.

All stacks are roughly 250.

A few limps - Hero raises to $15 with KK. Old man and TAG player call.

Flop is T 8 3

Old man checks. Tag bets $35. I figure the guy for a ten. I had been raising light and don't figure to always have a pair here. Old man cuts out $35 so I see him ready to call. Old man isn't making this call with anything less than AT. I can't really figure out what he has here and raising when a rock shows interest I think would be spew. I call, old man calls.

Turn 3

Interesting card. Any flush got there but pairs the board. Old man checks. The tag bets $55. I go into the tank. Not the worst card, but not the best either. I figure the TAG either has the 10 or a flush. I think I had the K of clubs, so I was leaning towards calling. I don't think he can fire 3 barrels without the flush, so a check on the river would have been easy value bet for me.

As I'm thinking though, the old man is looking at my chip stack. He is very interested in my stack and what I'm going to do here. He had been doing crosswords and all of a sudden he's paying attention. I figure he's not folding again, the question is what would a rock have here? He's doesn't appear scared at all of the club or the 3. Is this an obvious call? Obvious fold? Raise? Against the 1 player, I think it's obviously a call. With the old man eyeing me...I got really confused.

Opinions? Thanks in advance!

Did old man limp or is he Big blind?

Why is my first post always a question?

Old man was BB. I was button. TAG was mid position.

I raise flop, reads on old man not that strong, and hos range is still wide. Having said that, it is obviously that hardest thing in the world to convey these tell type things over a forum. I would not blame you for altering your line based on this. Probably the best thing I read (that i don't actually do) is to keep track of these "tells" and see how many turn out to be right over time.

Did you edit OP or am i a ******, sorry if the latter is the case.

Grunch.

Sweet mercy I can't imagine KK being all that good in this situation but I'm not sure I would have ended up in the same scenario.

I think I'd actually raise the flop out of pure tilt (donk bets tilt the **** out of me) so I guess I'd be losing my stack here unless I have a sick read that the TAG leads with monster hands (which some folk do).

Where you are now I think I find a fold because 1 pair against a TAG and a old-man-nit is trash.

Maybe I'm showing my nitty side here, but I think this is an obvious fold. Why can the guy who limp-called preflop and then bet out on flop and turn not have TT/88/33 here (especially 88/33, maybe not TT)? Furthermore we are out of relative position against the BB who might show up with a big hand himself here.

Anyway, this is a horrible turn for you and I would fold pretty confidently. The TAG donked out, got called in 2 spots, and kept betting when the flush completed. He has to really like his hand to do this.

I did not edit the OP. And yeah, it's hard to explain, but he was 100% into the hand. This is from previous hands and body language. Tough to explain, but it was pretty accurate.

I would not be the least bit surprised if you had the 3rd best hand here. I fold.

I don't get why you didn't raise the flop! As played the turn is a turbo muck.

raise flop. fold now.

Preflop: Good.

Flop: I would reraise to $80 and shut down if the old guy calls or raises. If he has a set he's probably not going to be so transparent about things, but you can't know that for sure. EDIT: This is the most important street of the hand.

Turn: By just calling on the flop you delayed the inevitable. As played on the flop I would min raise and if called check behind on the river for a free showdown. I like this play especially if you have the K

Just my opinion... and in the future remember to include stuff like what position the TAG limped in from and the suits of your cards. Those sorts of things are important to the play of the hand.

Can we really raise the flop and then fold without it being a spew?

To answer your question, you can't know that the TAG didn't flop a set, but it's fairly unlikely for someone to flop a set in a 3 handed pot and just bet out with a raiser yet to act. Most players will check/raise knowing the preflop raiser will almost always make a continuation bet.

I have to say that on a board like this against typical 1/2 players a set lead might not be such a bad play because there are so many cards that slow down a hand like QQ such as any , A or K and a donk bet might induce a spazz from a player like me or get value from a pair with a .

Raising and folding here is bad. Raising to 80 is pretty much a minraise and is something I never do.

If I raise here its to 120 but thats only after deciding if I want to play for stacks.

As far as the above comments about a player never donking out with a set, I always donk my sets. A check raise at 1/2 is viewed as super strong and will likely fold almost all worse hands out.

This is exactly my thoughts. Since on the flop we have about $235. Calling his bet would leave me with 200. Any decent raise is half my stack and the rock is still behind me and all of a sudden very interested. If the rock calls can you ever bet a turn/river for value or call profitably?

As for the TAG, he was a smart thinking player so his range is exceptionally wide. KT+, flush draws and over cards, sets, overpairs. My initial plan was to raise him, but the rock looking eager and knowing he was going to call the bet was scary.

Anymore opinions? Was I correct to assume the nit was on a monster? I guess it's hard to convey over the internet, but he had been doing a crossword puzzle for 30 minutes and now he's sitting up and eyeing my stack...not me...my stack.

This hand really confused me. Results in the afternoon.

Well results -

What was the river card? I would have lost my stack FWIW. The old man saved you some money fair play to him

River was a complete brick, 2 of diamonds or something.

Raise flop, Fold turn, 2 other players in the hand I wouldn't be surprised if u had the worse hand by the turn...

Don't agree with this. Plenty of people will lead out with the set into two people and hope to be raised.

As played, fine to call the flop. Folding the turn is good given reads.

This is too general, online I see TAG players do this with frequency, maybe your games are different than mine but I see very few players making donk bets with sets, @ 1/2 live. I am not saying it doesn't happen but considering there are way more combos of draws and Tx hands villain could be donk betting here than sets, TT is unlikely given preflop limp from a TAG player.

I am raising this flop pretty often here, and feeling pretty good about it, I am prob not folding unless old man cold shoves the flop then you are prob toast and can fold.

As played turn is snap fold given tells and reads.

I feel like TAG is much more likely to donk out with sets/FDs as opposed to top pair hands like AT, JT. therefore I think it's a fold on the turn

Did you stop and think about why the TAG is leading into you? I've seen weak leads as blocker bets on drawy boards. But those are usually less than half-pot. This almost feels like he put you on an overpair and led into you, the PFR, hoping you raise to set up a 3bet. But you just call and the old man calls.

On the turn, the TAG again led, but only 55 into a 150 pot! At this point, if he's good like you described, this isn't weakness. He obviously wants you all to call and he hoping one of you will raise! I'd fold the Kings on the turn. Even if you have the K of clubs, I don't expect a flush to be good hear most of the time.