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Live 6/12 TPTK turn check raise on drawy board Live 6/12 TPTK turn check raise on drawy board

04-26-2008 , 08:55 PM
This hand was from last night. This was from the first 6/12 table I was at (if you have read my low content thread post).

The SB (villain) in the hand is middle aged man. I worked at two different companies with him, although I never knew he played poker until a month ago. He is in marketing and I'm in engineering, so we never worked much together. I played one session with him a month ago. He is mostly a LP player, but capable of making moves postFlop occasionally. Doesn't raise much preflop, calls too much postflop. Last time we were playing together I was very card dead. He told me several times I need to stop waiting for AK. Previous session I saw him try to steal pots a few times. He knows I'm tight and capable of laying down hands when it is obvious I'm beat.

I'm UTG with A K

I raise, 3 callers, SB completes, BB folds

Flop is 7 A J, 6 players, 11 SB (after rake)

SB bets, I raise, 1 call, SB calls

Turn is Q, 3 players, 8.5 BB

SB checks, I bet, fold, SB check raises, I ???

SB might have the flush, straight or he might have two pair here. There is a small chance this might be some kind of a bluff. Do I call here? If he has only 2 pair, I have at least 7 outs, including the T outs to a straight. I called.

River was a blank.

SB bets, I ???

Do I call a bet on the river UI?

Against this kind of a live opponent I felt I had to call him down with TPTK. Is this reasonable or a leak?
Live 6/12 TPTK turn check raise on drawy board Quote
04-26-2008 , 09:22 PM
Mike,

Based on your description, I think you commit to SD on the turn. You have zero draws, and I'm not sure that he would ever check the river ahead or behind. The pot is 11.5 BB, and his river donk is going to make it 12.5. You win more than 1/6, especially since he thinks he can move you off a hand. Against a nit, this could be a fold.

Doug
Live 6/12 TPTK turn check raise on drawy board Quote
04-27-2008 , 05:28 PM
it's perfectly reasonable mike. even so, i wouldn't necessarily be automatically calling down in this type of spot. a turn c/r on that board after you showed strength on the previous two streets is a pretty stout play. alot of times against alot of players you can fold the turn. of course there are some players that you should never fold against. you're getting 5.75-1 on a calldown so you only need to think he's bluffing, semibluffing, or doing this with a worse hand 17% of the time.

one of the big mistakes that typical live players make is waiting for the turn to raise big hands rather than raising right away on the flop. the ability to exploit this tendency by folding decent hands allows you to save alot of big bets over time. even if this isn't the spot to do it, i wanted to mention it because it's important to keep in mind.
Live 6/12 TPTK turn check raise on drawy board Quote
04-27-2008 , 06:19 PM
Most of my play is online, I have very limited live experience.

I would lean towards laying this down on the turn c/r. We currently beat A10 and bluffs.

If their is an upside to paying down a potential best hand on the turn, it is to encourage him to take more shots at us in the future.
Live 6/12 TPTK turn check raise on drawy board Quote
04-28-2008 , 06:42 PM
This situation is very player dependent. I would clearly fold here against a lot of weak, passive players, but the villain did not completely match that description.

If the SB had a flush draw on the flop, I would not expect him to bet, as he did. Maybe he would bet the flop with a hand like K J. My gut feeling was he had a weak A, and was using the flush card to get me off the hand. As it turned out, I was half right. He had an A, but another AK. We chopped the pot. SB then told me I should have folded the turn after his check raise. I laughed that off, but it got me thinking whether he was right.
Live 6/12 TPTK turn check raise on drawy board Quote

      
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