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Sherlock - BBC TV Series Sherlock - BBC TV Series

01-02-2016 , 10:22 PM
You do realize that this was always a filler episode before next season?

Then you use an argument that doesn't make much sense. The fact it was a mind palace thing actually made it consequential to the actual series, unlike if it was Victorian time piece.
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01-03-2016 , 05:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fidstar-poker
You do realize that this was always a filler episode before next season?

Then you use an argument that doesn't make much sense. The fact it was a mind palace thing actually made it consequential to the actual series, unlike if it was Victorian time piece.
I know it was a filler episode, and it was working perfectly well as a one-off, Victorian period showpiece, until it decided to clumsily shoehorn in the main series. As he often does, Moffat mistakes convolution for cleverness.

The mind palace twist perfectly illustrated why "it's all a dream" is one of the laziest, worst plot devices ever created. It effectively nullified most of the episode and meant there were no stakes to what we had just been watching for an hour. The investigation and its outcome were cheapened as they were turned into merely the fevered imaginings of a drug-addled mind.

I could go on but fortunately someone's already discussed the problems at length: http://www.polygon.com/2016/1/2/1070...e-bride-review

Last edited by Rooksx; 01-03-2016 at 05:45 AM.
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01-03-2016 , 09:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooksx
I know it was a filler episode, and it was working perfectly well as a one-off, Victorian period showpiece, until it decided to clumsily shoehorn in the main series. As he often does, Moffat mistakes convolution for cleverness.

The mind palace twist perfectly illustrated why "it's all a dream" is one of the laziest, worst plot devices ever created. It effectively nullified most of the episode and meant there were no stakes to what we had just been watching for an hour. The investigation and its outcome were cheapened as they were turned into merely the fevered imaginings of a drug-addled mind.

I could go on but fortunately someone's already discussed the problems at length: http://www.polygon.com/2016/1/2/1070...e-bride-review
By the end of the dream sequence Sherlock had determined that Moriarty wasn't actually alive, which was what the episode was all about.

That review was interesting. Seemed to be just a summary/recap rather than review. He also wrote that Sherlock was digging up the grave of Moriarty. He might need to watch it again.

Most of the reviews seem to be quite positive, with many saying stuff like "2016 television is all downhill from here" etc. While I didn't feel it was the best thing we'll see this year, it was still very very good. Also could have skipped the scene of him digging up the grave.
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01-03-2016 , 07:09 PM
Saying a dream sequence episode is inconsequential and thus bad,despite direclty bridgibg the previous and future seasons, and a one off set in the Victorian era is good despite by definition having to be i consequential is the stupid thing I've read all year.

The episode only worked because it was linked directly to the moment Moriarty returned and it was an extremely important piece of development. The entire episode was a huge metaphor for how the next season could work. This a a Sherlock mapping out the next three cases. The dream sequence is how he is steps ahead of everyone but Moriarty, who planned his own ghost story to haunt London if he died. And we finally learned he definitely did die.

The investigation was him using an identical historical crime to give a reflection on the current story. It was a logical wholly linear narrative wrapped in an illusion.

Also it would have been ****ing stupid to just have an episode based in Victorian times with the same actors playing the same characters. The Moriarty twist made it work. Otherwise it's just a circle jerk of pathetic fan boys, the same ones crying about how Sherlock faked his own death.
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01-03-2016 , 07:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooksx
Solid start to the new season. Good dialogue and performances. I guess the explanation for Sherlock's survival makes sense but then I can't be bothered to examine it too closely. Perhaps it was a little too easy as everyone who saw Sherlock leap off the building was part of the deception except Watson.
Quote:
Originally Posted by [Phill]
The explanation was mundane but I guess the explanation to all magic trick illusions is mundane too when you know it.

Episode was good, not the best, but it was always going to be a bit clunky restarting the show after such a long break.

Looking forward to the second ep on Sunday a lot.
Hahaha i knew that if rooks had posted about the undeathening he would have said something exactly like that.

Fan boys who want things to be the next level at the cost of them being stupid are the worst. Sherlock should have used actual magic instead of misdirection and security services agents to fake his death. Sherlock should have been a time traveller to solve a Victorian era mystery instead of being a genius who also solved that same mystery but used it to discover whether Moriarty survived his apparent suicide (he did, he is the abominable bride).

The funniest thing is reaching to find something deeper means their understanding is made even shallower. Great magic is always too easy when you know how its done. An awesome special that is a huge metaphor is dismissed as an inconsequential dream sequence.
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01-03-2016 , 08:56 PM
I find it funny that people complain about the episode, but not an eyebrow is raised that Sherlock got away with murder, which is more unbelievable..
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01-03-2016 , 11:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fidstar-poker
I find it funny that people complain about the episode, but not an eyebrow is raised that Sherlock got away with murder, which is more unbelievable..
Well the queen owes him one from the episode with Adler.
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01-05-2016 , 04:26 AM
Will say it one final time - the Victorian setting and story was working very well in creating an enjoyable oneshot episode. IMO pulling the rug out from the setting undermined most of what we'd been watching. I don't care that it would not have otherwise tied into the proper show - it didn't need to in order to be a good episode. Would also point out that its impact on the main storyline is actually quite limited. What has Sherlock actually divined from his druggy trip? That Moriarty did not in fact survive putting a bullet in his own head. Well no ****.
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01-05-2016 , 04:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by [Phill]
Hahaha i knew that if rooks had posted about the undeathening he would have said something exactly like that.

Fan boys who want things to be the next level at the cost of them being stupid are the worst. Sherlock should have used actual magic instead of misdirection and security services agents to fake his death. Sherlock should have been a time traveller to solve a Victorian era mystery instead of being a genius who also solved that same mystery but used it to discover whether Moriarty survived his apparent suicide (he did, he is the abominable bride).

The funniest thing is reaching to find something deeper means their understanding is made even shallower. Great magic is always too easy when you know how its done. An awesome special that is a huge metaphor is dismissed as an inconsequential dream sequence.
Instead of mundane or magical explanations to extraordinary events, I would actually prefer it if the events were less over the top. Not really looking for things to go the next level or whatever other nonsense.
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01-10-2016 , 07:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooksx
Abominable Bride was great until it turned into a "dream", at which point it disappeared up its own arse and became a total mess. A one-off Sherlock set entirely in Victorian times would have been fine but Moffat has to show how clever he is.
just gonna add a -1 to this

if you didnt realize the episode was about moriarty as soon as we saw the bride who shot himself in the mouth coming back to life then ehhh
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01-10-2016 , 07:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirbynator
just gonna add a -1 to this

if you didnt realize the episode was about moriarty as soon as we saw the bride who shot himself in the mouth coming back to life then ehhh
and all the other subtle hints it was a dream sequence.
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01-02-2017 , 02:28 AM
so ****ing boring! ****!
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01-02-2017 , 04:33 AM
I thought that was pretty bad & very tropey.
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01-02-2017 , 06:09 AM
I would be happier if they just had an old fashioned mystery to solve for a whole episode instead of going off on a drama tangent.
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01-02-2017 , 06:13 AM
you can't make me dislike an episode of sherlock you FAWKS
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01-02-2017 , 05:19 PM
I liked it. Not as much as previous episodes (still better than the one last year) but it was oke. Now moriarty please
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01-03-2017 , 07:55 AM
What are the options for bringing Moriarty back? They keep repeating the "he's dead" line, which is similar to the Jon Snow storyline.

1) Twin brother? Sherlock even says the line "its never twins" in S4E1.
2) Moriarty was Richard Brook and the real Moriarty is someone else. Problem here is you cant bring back the excellent Andrew Scott.
3) Moriarty relative? Would still technically be Moriarty. Sister, Brother, Father etc.
4) He faked shooting himself which would be kind of silly and far fetched.
5) Or like the show says Moriarty is back in the form or a long term plan enacted whilst Moriarty still alive.
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01-03-2017 , 12:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WoodsGOAT
I would be happier if they just had an old fashioned mystery to solve for a whole episode instead of going off on a drama tangent.
Yeah, those honestly have been some of the best parts of the show. 90 minutes is just so long. Sherlock is a rare show in that it might actually benefit from having more, but shorter episodes.
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01-03-2017 , 12:38 PM
It wasn't bad, but it wasn't great either.

Was Moriarty somehow involved in this episode. His wants to make Sherlock's life hell and having Watson hate him would be a win for him.
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01-03-2017 , 01:22 PM
them killing moriarty was like killing the goose that was laying them golden eggs. hopefully they can figure it out, the show still has potential to be pretty great but seems to be all over the place right now.
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01-03-2017 , 06:40 PM
Very meh... glad the wife is gone though, her whole story was silly.

Hoping maybe Watson turns into an evil mastermind. I loved Moriarty, but I can't see any way he miraculously comes back without it being completely ridiculous.
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01-04-2017 , 04:13 AM
Fisticuffs and gunfights? Not really what Sherlock Holmes should be about. Confronting the killer alone was a particularly boneheaded move, especially for a supposed genius.
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01-07-2017 , 02:50 PM
How are you all watching this? There are only three seasons on Netflix for the longest time.
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01-07-2017 , 04:20 PM
Well, not everyone here is 'murican. Pretty sure it aired on UK TV. Not everyone is 50+ years old either, you can easily find everything online.
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01-07-2017 , 04:31 PM
It's back on the BBC. Next episode is tomorrow night.
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