Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player

10-20-2009 , 10:29 PM
So here's the game:

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 e6 3. Nc3 a6 4. d4 cxd4 5. Nxd4 Qb6 6. Nb3 Qc7 7. Bd3 b5 8. a3
Bb7 9. O-O Nf6 10. Qe2 d5 11. Bg5 Nbd7 12. Rad1 Bd6 13. h3 O-O 14. Rfe1 dxe4
15. Nxe4 Nxe4 16. Bxe4 Bxe4 17. Qxe4 Nc5 18. Qg4 Nxb3 19. Bf6 g6 20. cxb3 Rfc8
21. Bc3 Rd8 22. Rc1 Rac8 23. Qg5 Be7 24. Qe3 Qc5 25. Bd4 Qg5 26. f4 Qd5 27.
Rxc8 Rxc8 28. Kh1 Rc2 29. Rg1 f6 30. b4 Kf7 31. Bc3 Qc4 32. Qg3 Qe2 33. Qg4
Qxg4 34. hxg4 Rf2 35. Rd1 Rxf4 36. Rd7 Rxg4 37. Ra7 e5 38. Rxa6 e4 39. a4 bxa4
40. b5 Rg5 41. Rxa4 Rxb5 42. Rxe4 f5 43. Rc4 Rb7 44. Rc6 Rd7 45. Kg1 g5 46. Kf1
f4 47. Ke2 g4 48. Rh6 Kg8 49. Rc6 Rd6 50. Rc7 Re6+ 51. Kf2 Bd6 52. Rc8+ Kf7 53.
Rh8 Kg6 54. Rg8+ Kf5 55. Rh8 Bc5+ 56. Kf1 Re7 57. Rf8+ Ke4 58. Rc8 f3 59. Rxc5
fxg2+ 60. Kxg2 Rf7 61. Rc4+ Kd3 62. Rd4+ Kc2 63. Rxg4 Kb3 64. Kg3 Rd7 65. Kh4
Rc7 0-1

Position before 10. .. d5


I thought it was a really interesting game. We were following quite alot of decently high level games (mostly by transposition) up until move 10. My 10. .. d5 is apparently, more or less, a novelty. It's only been played 5 times, highest rated player was 2300. So it seems somehow it must not be good - but I can't find it. And in the 5 times it's been played, black has scored 4.5/5. I was aware of this when I played it, hoping to see if my opponent could show me why it's bad. I guess the right answer probably is that d5 isn't bad, but d6 is better.


Position before 14. .. dxe4


The other major decision was on move 14. I really wanted to play 14. .. Be5!? but my spidey sense started going off. White's pieces really do look very dangerously placed after 14. .. Be5 15. exd5 Nxd5 16. Ne4. I still can't find anything forcing, but that position sure is sharp. I decided to trade down into what I figured to be a very favorable endgame. His pawn on c2 will be a constant target and I can mess up his pawns on the queenside pretty easily. But this is also a major concession, as I'm trying to relieve the tension white is able to get some level of initiative on the kingside dark squares.


Position before 35. Rd1?!


By move 35 or so we were both running pretty low on time, but the game was already over by then. Eg: 35. g3 e5!! 36. fxe fxe 37. Bxe5 Bf6 38. Bxf6 Kxf6 39. Rg2 Rf1+ 40. Kh2 Kg5 -+

I don't have too many comments about the game itself aside from that. As seems to often happen in these sicilians, the game pretty much played itself. White made a bunch of threats and I made the moves he pretty much forced me to make and came out with a winning position pretty easily.

But any feedback or other ideas or questions about the game would be great too. I think it's an interesting game played against a solid opponent.
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
10-21-2009 , 03:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dire
So here's the game:

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 e6 3. Nc3 a6 4. d4 cxd4 5. Nxd4 Qb6 6. Nb3 Qc7 7. Bd3 b5 8. a3
Bb7 9. O-O Nf6 10. Qe2 d5 11. Bg5 Nbd7 12. Rad1 Bd6 13. h3 O-O 14. Rfe1 dxe4
15. Nxe4 Nxe4 16. Bxe4 Bxe4 17. Qxe4 Nc5 18. Qg4 Nxb3 19. Bf6 g6 20. cxb3 Rfc8
21. Bc3 Rd8 22. Rc1 Rac8 23. Qg5 Be7 24. Qe3 Qc5 25. Bd4 Qg5 26. f4 Qd5 27.
Rxc8 Rxc8 28. Kh1 Rc2 29. Rg1 f6 30. b4 Kf7 31. Bc3 Qc4 32. Qg3 Qe2 33. Qg4
Qxg4 34. hxg4 Rf2 35. Rd1 Rxf4 36. Rd7 Rxg4 37. Ra7 e5 38. Rxa6 e4 39. a4 bxa4
40. b5 Rg5 41. Rxa4 Rxb5 42. Rxe4 f5 43. Rc4 Rb7 44. Rc6 Rd7 45. Kg1 g5 46. Kf1
f4 47. Ke2 g4 48. Rh6 Kg8 49. Rc6 Rd6 50. Rc7 Re6+ 51. Kf2 Bd6 52. Rc8+ Kf7 53.
Rh8 Kg6 54. Rg8+ Kf5 55. Rh8 Bc5+ 56. Kf1 Re7 57. Rf8+ Ke4 58. Rc8 f3 59. Rxc5
fxg2+ 60. Kxg2 Rf7 61. Rc4+ Kd3 62. Rd4+ Kc2 63. Rxg4 Kb3 64. Kg3 Rd7 65. Kh4
Rc7 0-1

Position before 10. .. d5


I thought it was a really interesting game. We were following quite alot of decently high level games (mostly by transposition) up until move 10. My 10. .. d5 is apparently, more or less, a novelty. It's only been played 5 times, highest rated player was 2300. So it seems somehow it must not be good - but I can't find it. And in the 5 times it's been played, black has scored 4.5/5. I was aware of this when I played it, hoping to see if my opponent could show me why it's bad. I guess the right answer probably is that d5 isn't bad, but d6 is better.


Position before 14. .. dxe4


The other major decision was on move 14. I really wanted to play 14. .. Be5!? but my spidey sense started going off. White's pieces really do look very dangerously placed after 14. .. Be5 15. exd5 Nxd5 16. Ne4. I still can't find anything forcing, but that position sure is sharp. I decided to trade down into what I figured to be a very favorable endgame. His pawn on c2 will be a constant target and I can mess up his pawns on the queenside pretty easily. But this is also a major concession, as I'm trying to relieve the tension white is able to get some level of initiative on the kingside dark squares.


Position before 35. Rd1?!


By move 35 or so we were both running pretty low on time, but the game was already over by then. Eg: 35. g3 e5!! 36. fxe fxe 37. Bxe5 Bf6 38. Bxf6 Kxf6 39. Rg2 Rf1+ 40. Kh2 Kg5 -+

I don't have too many comments about the game itself aside from that. As seems to often happen in these sicilians, the game pretty much played itself. White made a bunch of threats and I made the moves he pretty much forced me to make and came out with a winning position pretty easily.

But any feedback or other ideas or questions about the game would be great too. I think it's an interesting game played against a solid opponent.
Apart from the d5 stuff it follows pretty standard sicilian themes. Hold em off till the endgame and win with superior pawn structure etc. Good game though.

I'll do a lil research on the d5 line see what I can dig up...it seems odd to me to try and open the lanes for his rooks etc. But I can't find it to be immediately bad either.
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
10-21-2009 , 07:38 AM
I can't see anything wrong with 10...d5.

White was a bit better at move 20 though. Instead of 21.Bc3?! he should play 21.Qh4 with the idea to double his rooks and pentrate on either d7 or d8.



Black should be able to defend after 21...Bf8 22.Rd2 Bg7 23.Red1 Bxf6 24.Qxf6 Rf8 25.Rd7 Qc5 26.b4 Qf5.

21...Ra7?! 22.Rd4 (Idea Qxh7+) 22...Bf8 (22...h5 23.g4!) 23.Red1 looks dangerous for Black.
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
10-21-2009 , 05:59 PM
It is a matter of taste if you prefer french structures or sicilian structures, but I would always play it with d6 in such a position.

I assume the "refutation" of 10...d5 is simply 11.e5 Nfd7 12.f4 Nc5 13.Be3! This doesn't give white a huge advantage, but the bishop on b7 is blocked and white keeps control over d4 which is usually enough to guarantee a good position.

Nevertheless I have to admit that I am starting to like the variation with e6/Qb6. Whenever the name Kasparov shows up after a few transpositions, it is always a good sign!
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
10-21-2009 , 06:24 PM
nice..seems like a well-played game to this pazter

Its been a while since but 10..d5 seems positionally loose since it slows developement and opens up the middle too soon 11.Rfe1 builds pressures on the center. 11 .....Nbd7 e5 constrains black and 11...dxe4 12.Nxe4 opens center before black is developed. (Magnus would crush this ).
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
10-21-2009 , 06:57 PM
looks like White has a forced repetition on move 24 with Qh6 Bf8, Qg5 threatening Qf6 when Qe7/Bg7 are both impossible and so Be7 is forced. I'm not certain that White should take the draw (I think he probably should, because I don't think he will mate you by other means and he will just have a worse endgame) but at least it means you haven't got the advantage here.
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
10-22-2009 , 02:52 AM
Yeah, I think I really underestimated how well just his queen + bishop would coordinate after the exchanges.

I just ran into another fairly similar situation.



Yet again black can make his d5 which is generally supposed to be good for him in these sort of positions, and you also have a ton of GMs playing it as well. But the top players to reach this position (Ivanchuk/Movsesian) chose d6 and a6 respectively instead.

That game proceeded 1. .. d5 2. Nc3 dxe 3. Nxe4 Nbd7 4. Nd4 a6 5. Re1 when I think white just has a comfortable and fairly large edge.

I think I'm going to start playing d6 in these positions. It keeps the position complex and even if d5 does allow black to equalize, it seems to often leave his position somewhat passive.
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
10-22-2009 , 04:52 AM
Even here, yet another position where d5 seems great:



The funny thing is, even a ton of GMs have played d5 here and it scores incredibly well in practice (black is actually scoring 75%!) - but I think it's quite bad if white plays accurately.

Eg- 1. .. d5 2. exd5 Nxd5 3. Nxd5 Bxd5 4. a4! b4 5. Qh5!! (if 5. Re1 h5! is good for black) Ne7 6. Bd4! Be7 7. Re1 with a somewhat dangerous initiative and black once again having a rather passive position.

White has to play super accurately there though as if he makes even a single slight inaccuracy or lazy move (5. Re1 in particular) black gets a very dangerous initiative. In my own games, I also score incredibly well from that position. But now I think I need to stop playing it.
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
10-22-2009 , 06:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dire
That game proceeded 1. .. d5 2. Nc3 dxe 3. Nxe4 Nbd7 4. Nd4 a6 5. Re1 when I think white just has a comfortable and fairly large edge.
White has an even better way of playing this (borrowed from the French): 4. Nxf6! Nxf6 5. Nd4 a6 6. Re1 Bd6?! 7. Nf5! Bxh2 8. Kh1 0-0? 9. Nxg7!!

The whole analogy to the French Tarrasch with c5 and Qxd5 could be the reason why the big boys all play d6 in such a position.
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote
11-08-2009 , 02:48 AM
yeah like shandrax said, e5, f4 and Be3 just look a bit better for white
Qb6 sicilian slow chess vs good player Quote

      
m