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re-cubing when if you lose game you lose match re-cubing when if you lose game you lose match

03-15-2012 , 07:29 PM
Some guy on my youtube channel has been harassing me like crazy about a cube decision. It was 0 - 1 and the match was to three ( i am down one point).
The guys sends the cube over and I take it. I do not send the cube over right away because I am hoping there will be a position later in the game where my best equity play will be to send the cube back. This guy argues and says you should always send the cube back immediatley because he is going to win if u lose so you might as well redouble and if you win then you win the match. I was 100% sure i was right but this guy is so insistent that I am doubting myself. Who is correct?
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03-15-2012 , 08:53 PM
The correct play is to reship at your first opportunity.
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03-15-2012 , 08:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ender1204
This guy argues and says you should always send the cube back immediatley because he is going to win if u lose so you might as well redouble and if you win then you win the match.
What do you feel is wrong with this argument?
re-cubing when if you lose game you lose match Quote
03-15-2012 , 09:20 PM
perhaps later in the game I turn the position around and get up. I can send the cube back and he may possibly either A. make an equity error and drop the cube when he should take it. or B. Be in a position where I have a superior position and I want him to dorp the cube so he doesnt lucky roll out on me. Am i missing something? Why recube right away when I can wait to do it later. Yes, its true that at SOME point I will for sure send the cube back, but why rush?
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03-15-2012 , 10:06 PM
You don't want him to drop, you want him to take your instant redouble, so when/if you turn things around, you also win the match.

If he drops, you're ahead 2-1 Crawford, which is pretty good (roughly 70-75% favorite), but that's terribad compared to the fact that you would have won the match, had you redoubled at your first opportunity (which he would have taken obviously).

Edit: I understand that there are a few scenarios where it would go like this: 1) you hold the cube 2) you come back 3) you either lose your market or he incorrectly drops 4) he would have otherwise won the game and match had he not dropped the cube

Those are the only scenarios where you would have been better holding the cube, but they are very rare and they certainly don't make up for the lost equity by not doubling.

Last edited by uberkuber; 03-15-2012 at 10:11 PM. Reason: Added thoughts
re-cubing when if you lose game you lose match Quote
03-15-2012 , 10:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ender1204
perhaps later in the game I turn the position around and get up. I can send the cube back and he may possibly either A. make an equity error and drop the cube when he should take it. or B. Be in a position where I have a superior position and I want him to dorp the cube so he doesnt lucky roll out on me. Am i missing something? Why recube right away when I can wait to do it later. Yes, its true that at SOME point I will for sure send the cube back, but why rush?
There is some truth to what you're saying. If there was absolutely zero chance that on the upcoming sequence (your roll AND his) that you would never lose your market, then it doesn't hurt to wait. But the only way you will ever gain from this strategy is as you mention, that you get him to make the mistake of passing a take later on, and for most positions it's very unlikely that you will be able to achieve this without reaching a position where you risk losing your market.

So most of the time in order to get a chance to reach a position where he MIGHT make mistake, you most likely would have to make several mistakes yourself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ender1204
or B. Be in a position where I have a superior position and I want him to dorp the cube so he doesnt lucky roll out on me.
oh god no. If you end up in this situation, then you're the sucker. Consider this: You are in race as an 80% favorite to win and you're sitting with the cube still on your side. Sure you can cube him out and be sure to win this game and be ahead 2-1, but that only makes you a 68% favorite. Wouldn't you much rather be able to play out this game for the match as an 80% favorite.
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03-15-2012 , 10:25 PM
thanks guys...you really cleared it up...I owe my youtube stalker an apology
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