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04-22-2015 , 10:10 AM
We are trailing by 35 pips, so race is not an option. I want to attack the back checker and maximize contact. Getting hit is not a problem since opp has no board. If he hits our 16-pt. blot, he looses the midpoint, risk some return shots, and even if we don't hit, we could enter at 1 or 2-pt. to take away some safe landing spots from him.

I want to put checkers where they work maximum for the blocking/attacking the back guy, and leave the 16-pt. blot to keep contact. I guess in such early stage few plays will be close, but the only logical play for me is 13/9 6/5.
Open your mind Quote
04-23-2015 , 05:46 PM
White - Pips 133

Black - Pips 168
Position 19. Black to Play 4-1

Unlimited game, no Jacoby, no beavers
XGID=--a---D-D---bD--Aebe--B---:0:0:1:41:0:0:0:0:10


This may look like two beginners have been building candlesticks, but this game has been well played so far. Both players have been rolling 5s, and to to cap it off, White just rolled a 66.
  1. Black 52-split: 24/22, 13/8
  2. White 54-split: 24/20, 13/8

  3. Black 21-hit and anchor: 24/22, 6/5*
  4. White 51-up: bar/20*, 24/23

  5. Black 63-run: bar/16
  6. White 66-reverse split: 20/8, 13/7(2)

  7. Black 41 ?

Over the board, I played 16/11, thinking that I did not want to be hit, and that the 11pt was the optimal destination for a checker in my outer board. That play is a near-whopper!

The blot on the 16pt is doing fine right where it is. It exerts pressure both on White’s midpoint and on the high points in Black’s outer board. White would have to break his midpoint to hit, something that might leave his outer board in a mess. Note also the connectivity. The 16pt is within direct range of Black’s anchor, so he can hit from there if it becomes desirable.

Thinking about game plans will help here. White has jumped out to a huge racing advantage, so Black does not want to play a running game. Anything that reduces contact, such as playing 16/11, will help White further his plans to run. Black needs to play a priming game or some sort of a tactical holding game.

The best 4, therefore, is to play down from the midpoint. After that, the ace could be played 16/15, but a better play is to slot the 5pt. It looks like that volunteers a double direct-shot, because both 3 and 4 hit, but White will not be anxious to break his midpoint. When Black’s slot is not hit, Black gains in the priming battle. When the slot is hit, Black will often be able to use that checker to good advantage in a holding game. A third checker back may give him the flexibility he needs to advance his anchor. Slotting is a two-way move that supports both a priming game and a holding game.

Here’s my 31k rollout.

Position 19. Rollout
Code:
XGID=--a---D-D---bD--Aebe--B---:0:0:1:41:0:0:0:0:10

X:Player 1   O:Player 2
Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
Pip count  X: 168  O: 133 X-O: 0-0
Cube: 1
X to play 41

    1. Rollout¹    13/9 6/5          eq:-0.3488
      Player:   43.20% (G:8.84% B:0.34%)
      Opponent: 56.80% (G:18.89% B:0.79%)
      Confidence: ±0.0035 (-0.3523..-0.3453) - [100.0%]

    2. Rollout¹    16/15 13/9        eq:-0.3603 (-0.0115)
      Player:   41.73% (G:8.43% B:0.31%)
      Opponent: 58.27% (G:15.63% B:0.59%)
      Confidence: ±0.0031 (-0.3634..-0.3573) - [0.0%]

    3. Rollout²    16/11             eq:-0.4388 (-0.0900)
      Player:   38.93% (G:7.48% B:0.26%)
      Opponent: 61.07% (G:12.74% B:0.42%)
      Confidence: ±0.0068 (-0.4456..-0.4321) - [0.0%]

¹  31104 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
   Dice Seed: 46439202
   Moves: 3-ply, cube decisions: XG Roller

²  5184 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
   Dice Seed: 46439202
   Moves: 3-ply, cube decisions: XG Roller

Rollout by Taper_Mike
2015-Apr-22
eXtreme Gammon Version: 2.10.199.2658
52S-54S-21X-51U-63R-66Z-41-n-tm.xgp
Posted at TwoPlusTwo.com as:
OpenYourMind.019

This position is very sensitive to the location of Black’s anchor. Moving it forward just one pip is all it takes to make the safer 16/15 13/9 come out on top. Moving the anchor up to the 20pt gives that play an even larger edge. From either of those anchors, Black can already engineer a decent holding game. The “advantage” in having a slotted checker hit is much smaller. Note that 16/11 still fairs poorly in both of these variants.


White - Pips 133

Black - Pips 166
Position 19a. Black to Play 4-1

Code:
XGID=--a---D-D---bD--Aebe-B----:0:0:1:41:0:0:0:0:10

X:Player 1   O:Player 2
Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
Pip count  X: 166  O: 133 X-O: 0-0
Cube: 1
X to play 41

    1. Rollout¹    16/15 13/9        eq:-0.3232
      Player:   41.96% (G:8.16% B:0.28%)
      Opponent: 58.04% (G:13.03% B:0.42%)
      Confidence: ±0.0067 (-0.3299..-0.3165) - [100.0%]

    2. Rollout¹    13/9 6/5          eq:-0.3832 (-0.0600)
      Player:   42.13% (G:8.23% B:0.32%)
      Opponent: 57.87% (G:18.47% B:0.64%)
      Confidence: ±0.0083 (-0.3915..-0.3749) - [0.0%]

    3. Rollout¹    16/11             eq:-0.4030 (-0.0798)
      Player:   39.38% (G:6.99% B:0.23%)
      Opponent: 60.62% (G:11.62% B:0.33%)
      Confidence: ±0.0064 (-0.4094..-0.3966) - [0.0%]

¹  5184 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
   Dice Seed: 46439202
   Moves: 3-ply, cube decisions: XG Roller

Rollout by Taper_Mike
2015-Apr-23
eXtreme Gammon Version: 2.10.199.2658
OpenYourMind.019.AnchorOn21pt.xgp

It is hard to find a variant where 16/11 is correct. The race needs to be much less lopsided. Moving a White checker from his 8pt back to the midpoint won’t do it. Moving two, makes it close. Any further change takes you so far away from the original that you are no longer comparing similar positions.


White - Pips 143

Black - Pips 168
Position 19b. Black to Play 4-1

Code:
XGID=--a---D-D---dD--Acbe--B---:0:0:1:41:0:0:0:0:10

X:Player 1   O:Player 2
Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
Pip count  X: 168  O: 143 X-O: 0-0
Cube: 1
X to play 41

    1. Rollout¹    16/15 13/9         eq:-0.4330
      Player:   39.52% (G:8.34% B:0.29%)
      Opponent: 60.48% (G:14.63% B:0.57%)
      Confidence: ±0.0031 (-0.4361..-0.4299) - [91.4%]

    2. Rollout¹    13/9 6/5          eq:-0.4363 (-0.0033)
      Player:   40.60% (G:8.61% B:0.33%)
      Opponent: 59.40% (G:18.27% B:0.83%)
      Confidence: ±0.0036 (-0.4399..-0.4327) - [8.6%]

    3. Rollout²    16/11             eq:-0.4445 (-0.0115)
      Player:   38.38% (G:7.51% B:0.24%)
      Opponent: 61.62% (G:11.34% B:0.42%)
      Confidence: ±0.0042 (-0.4486..-0.4403) - [0.0%]

¹  31104 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
   Dice Seed: 46439202
   Moves: 3-ply, cube decisions: XG Roller

²  15552 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
   Dice Seed: 46439202
   Moves: 3-ply, cube decisions: XG Roller

Rollout by Taper_Mike
2015-Apr-23
eXtreme Gammon Version: 2.10.199.2658
OpenYourMind.019.UnstackingWhite's8ptpt.xgp
Mike
Open your mind Quote
04-23-2015 , 09:53 PM
Nice analysis Mike.

I would also add that 13/9 16/15 gains value when you advance Black's anchor (21 or 20 pt) because the checker on the 15-pt is now still connected (6 pips or less) with the anchor as opposed to the original position.
Open your mind Quote
04-28-2015 , 05:50 AM
Position ID: 78Y5AAC1bQDgQQ Match ID: UokKAAAAAAAE


White - Pips 58

Black - Pips 144
Black to Play 5-2
Created with www.BGdiagram.com
Open your mind Quote
04-28-2015 , 07:33 AM
I am scared to say anything because this looks like a trick...

Bar / 18

Surely? Please..
Open your mind Quote
04-28-2015 , 08:16 AM
I'm with Kamba here, I can't see the point in playing 4/2 or 3/1, to avoid being hit.
Open your mind Quote
04-28-2015 , 09:46 AM
B/18.
Open your mind Quote
04-28-2015 , 10:50 AM
This looks like an obvious a.k.a. automatic one.

Everything goes after B/18:
- I don't think it risks more gammons because White won't hit with every 1, and after hitting we can enter on lower point to create more troubles for him
- unstacks = flexibility
- keeps good board

I wouldn't spend much time here.
Open your mind Quote
04-28-2015 , 02:03 PM
One way I like to look at this is 20/18 has both good (flexibility, chance to make the 18) and bad qualities, while 4/2 is a purely destructive thing. So even if you're not sure if the good of 20/18 outweighs the bad, it still implies B/18 is correct.
Open your mind Quote
04-29-2015 , 03:17 AM
White - Pips 58

Black - Pips 144
Code:
    1. bar/18                       Eq.:  -1,125 
       0,149 0,016 0,000 - 0,851 0,498 0,001 CL  -1,184 CF  -1,125 
     
    2. bar/20 4/2                   Eq.:  -1,251 ( -0,127) 
       0,105 0,010 0,000 - 0,895 0,509 0,000 CL  -1,289 CF  -1,251
As a matter of fact, turning 1b into a builder makes bar/18 still a good favorite:
White - Pips 58

Black - Pips 149
Code:
    1. Rollout          bar/18                       Eq.:  -1,093
       0,161 0,017 0,000 - 0,839 0,489 0,001 CL  -1,151 CF  -1,093
    
    2. bar/20 6/4                   Eq.:  -1,173 ( -0,081)
       0,132 0,013 0,000 - 0,868 0,498 0,000 CL  -1,221 CF  -1,173
This means that bar/18 is a strong move on it's own merit. When there is no gap in the board, the options are pretty close:


Code:
    1. bar/20 4/2                   Eq.:  -1,279
       0,084 0,005 0,000 - 0,916 0,482 0,001 CL  -1,310 CF  -1,279
      
    2. bar/18                       Eq.:  -1,295 ( -0,016)
       0,097 0,007 0,000 - 0,903 0,532 0,002 CL  -1,332 CF  -1,295

Moving a black checker from 20 to 7 diminishes the relative value of bar/18:
White - Pips 58

Black - Pips 136
Code:
    1. bar/18                       Eq.:  -0,864
       0,167 0,017 0,000 - 0,833 0,259 0,000 CL  -0,909 CF  -0,864
     
    2. bar/20 6/4                   Eq.:  -0,907 ( -0,043)
       0,136 0,013 0,000 - 0,864 0,229 0,000 CL  -0,943 CF  -0,907
The main reason is that black has more chance now to save the gammon, and a hit on the 18-point could spoil that.

So as gammon loss is less of an issue in the original position, there is also less to lose with bar/18. The downside comes if white leaves a blot on 17w while black is on the bar. This doesn't outweigh the upsides:
– getting a double shot, with or without two checkers on the 18-point
– if hit, the possibility of entering on the 21-point. This is still more detrimental in case white breaks his 6-point with some 3's (and 1's), or leaves a blot on the 21-point with some unlucky 4.
Open your mind Quote
04-30-2015 , 01:53 AM
White - Pips 64

Black - Pips 132
Position 21. Black to Play 6-5

Jacoby Rule in force and beavers allowed
XGID=-B-BBBB-A--------c--fBBdb-:1:1:1:65:0:0:3:0:10


This is one I botched over the board.

Mike
Open your mind Quote
04-30-2015 , 02:31 AM
I can't say I'm confident in my answer here. I would play 22/16 21/16, in the hopes of being left with a shot when white rolls ghastly dice. I'm going more with what I remember XG doing in similar situations, than with a solid grounding of theory, which very often leads me astray.
Open your mind Quote
04-30-2015 , 03:36 AM
I think I may play 21/10 leaving a shot and an anchor.

Depending on what white throws, I would be planning to move off my 22 point on the next throw. I think he'll be much more awkward after his next throw, which will make my double shot a bit more dangerous for him.

I too am basing this on nothing more than a gut feeling...
Open your mind Quote
04-30-2015 , 07:03 AM
21/16 8/2.

I know I might not be ready to cover it if I hit soon, but I'm willing to recirculate it if it comes to that.
Open your mind Quote
04-30-2015 , 09:37 AM
When you can't keep both anchors, the routine play is to run one man off the front anchor. That way you'll still generate some double shots while keeping the back anchor as long as you can. So my first choice would just be 21/10.

Once in a while, leaving the back anchor will create some unusual horror numbers. In this position, playing 22/11 leaves White with one double-blot number: 65. Is that enough to swing the play? Probably not, since it makes 51, 52, 55, 21, and 22 all very good shots which mostly reduce you to just a 4-point game.

I'll keep my mind closed here and just stick with the standard 21/10.
Open your mind Quote
05-01-2015 , 09:06 AM
Routine is 21/10. Running from back anchor is almost always worse, excluding some egzotic tricky positions, when it is right, just like Bill pointed out.

Alternative one-man running plays like 21/15 8/3 or 21/16 8/2 are usually worse, since thay give too many joker scenarios for opp. Especially without direct cover for 2-pt. blot had it been played.

More often the alternative to consider is double-running from the front anchor with 21/15 21/16 here. It will net less wins, but saves many gammons. So it's a usual play for GS (Gammon Save) scenarios. That includes either special match scores, or positions where You have Your board crunched, so Your main goal is to save the gammon anyway.

Here, it seems everything's speaking after a routine 21/10.
Open your mind Quote
05-02-2015 , 02:13 AM
White - Pips 64

Black - Pips 132
Position 21. Black to Play 6-5

Jacoby Rule in force and beavers allowed
XGID=-B-BBBB-A--------c--fBBdb-:1:1:1:65:0:0:3:0:10


In these sorts of positions, breaking the front anchor is almost automatic, so I gave myself a pat on the back for being open to the alternative. I thought I was very clever to observe that I could create several blotting 5s for my opponent by breaking from the rear. After moving 22/11, the rolls 53, 54, and 56 all become blotting numbers, with the last of them forcing two blots. Unfortunately, 22/11 is the wrong play. It is, in fact, a whopper.

One problem is that the direct shots that result are all single shots. If I break the front anchor instead, I increase the odds of getting a double shot at any blot that might appear. More significantly, when I keep the rear anchor, my opponent will have a tougher time clearing both the 17pt and the 20pt.

Breaking the rear anchor generates more shots on the next roll. In the long run, however, it eases the opponent’s burden of clearing.

My 5k rollout follows.

Mike


5k XG2 Rollout – Jacoby Rule in force and beavers allowed
Code:
XGID=-B-BBBB-A--------c--fBBdb-:1:1:1:65:0:0:3:0:10

X:Player 1   O:Player 2
Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game, Jacoby Beaver
Pip count  X: 132  O: 64 X-O: 0-0
Cube: 2, X own cube
X to play 65

    1. Rollout¹    21/10             eq:-0.2987
      Player:   34.86% (G:3.43% B:0.08%)
      Opponent: 65.14% (G:14.51% B:0.10%)
      Confidence: ±0.0026 (-0.3013..-0.2961) - [100.0%]
      Duration: 7 minutes 15 seconds

    2. Rollout¹    21/15 8/3         eq:-0.3159 (-0.0172)
      Player:   34.20% (G:3.16% B:0.07%)
      Opponent: 65.80% (G:15.91% B:0.10%)
      Confidence: ±0.0025 (-0.3184..-0.3134) - [0.0%]
      Duration: 6 minutes 40 seconds

    3. Rollout¹    21/16 8/2         eq:-0.3372 (-0.0385)
      Player:   34.38% (G:3.31% B:0.08%)
      Opponent: 65.62% (G:17.92% B:0.14%)
      Confidence: ±0.0028 (-0.3400..-0.3344) - [0.0%]
      Duration: 6 minutes 22 seconds

    4. Rollout¹    21/16 21/15       eq:-0.3465 (-0.0479)
      Player:   31.05% (G:2.34% B:0.06%)
      Opponent: 68.95% (G:9.15% B:0.05%)
      Confidence: ±0.0028 (-0.3493..-0.3437) - [0.0%]
      Duration: 8 minutes 04 seconds

    5. Rollout¹    22/11             eq:-0.4222 (-0.1236)
      Player:   30.97% (G:3.48% B:0.10%)
      Opponent: 69.03% (G:18.20% B:0.06%)
      Confidence: ±0.0024 (-0.4247..-0.4198) - [0.0%]
      Duration: 8 minutes 45 seconds

¹  5184 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
   Dice Seed: 31715667
   Moves: 3-ply, cube decisions: XG Roller

Rollout by Taper_Mike
2015-Apr-19
eXtreme Gammon Version: 2.10.199.2658
Open your mind Quote
05-02-2015 , 02:24 AM
White - Pips 60

Black - Pips 132
Problem 21 Variant – Black to Play 6-5

Here is a variant where breaking from the rear is correct.


XGR++ Eval
Code:
XGID=-B-BBBB-A--------c--fBB-f-:1:1:1:65:0:0:3:0:10

X:Player 1   O:Player 2
Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game, Jacoby Beaver
Pip count  X: 132  O: 60 X-O: 0-0
Cube: 2, X own cube
X to play 65

    1. XG Roller++ 22/11             eq:-0.0344
      Player:   43.61% (G:9.34% B:0.35%)
      Opponent: 56.39% (G:13.54% B:0.04%)

    2. XG Roller++ 21/10             eq:-0.0917 (-0.0574)
      Player:   42.63% (G:6.32% B:0.18%)
      Opponent: 57.37% (G:12.32% B:0.05%)

eXtreme Gammon Version: 2.10
Open your mind Quote
05-03-2015 , 03:46 AM
Position ID: mM9GESCwuwdgQA Match ID: cIkKAAAAAAAE

White - Pips 137

Black - Pips 142
Black to Play 5-2
Created with www.BGdiagram.com
Open your mind Quote
05-03-2015 , 06:12 AM
We have positional advantage, so we don't want to get into cockfight right now, which would nullify that. Both sides have 2-pt. boards, both sides have many hits&return shots. If we get blitzed, our blockade won't matter.

On the other hand, this logic failed me many times, as I recall bot valuing hitting most often higher in similar positions.

Here, I'd vote for b/18, as I can't really point out dominant advantages for hitting.
Open your mind Quote
05-04-2015 , 03:47 AM
I would have hit without any thought. Having read the previous post, I'm now not so sure.

However, I still think our trap is better, we have more builders, and I think black hitting white hurts him more than white hitting black.

So I'll go with my instinct and play:

B/23 18/13*
Open your mind Quote
05-04-2015 , 05:43 AM
I think hitting leaves us too exposed. White will most likely come in, and then we are in real trouble. He has lots of ammo bearing down on us, and his trap can form quickly. I'd play B/18.
Open your mind Quote
05-04-2015 , 07:24 AM
White - Pips 137

Black - Pips 142
Code:
    1. bar/18                       Eq.:  +0,614
       0,652 0,159 0,005 - 0,348 0,060 0,002 CL  +0,407 CF  +0,614
     
    2. bar/23 18/13*                Eq.:  +0,502 ( -0,112)
       0,621 0,226 0,020 - 0,379 0,125 0,008 CL  +0,357 CF  +0,502
Improving blacks board by shifting the 4-prime one point makes 18/13* almost as strong:
White - Pips 137

Black - Pips 130
Code:
    1. bar/18                       Eq.:  +0,945
       0,713 0,238 0,005 - 0,287 0,048 0,001 CL  +0,620 CF  +0,945
    
    2. bar/23 18/13*                Eq.:  +0,904 ( -0,040)
       0,694 0,360 0,043 - 0,306 0,083 0,005 CL  +0,705 CF  +0,904
Moving 19w to 1:
White - Pips 155

Black - Pips 142
Code:
    1. bar/18                       Eq.:  +0,957
       0,722 0,210 0,010 - 0,278 0,055 0,001 CL  +0,608 CF  +0,957
     
    2. bar/23 18/13*                Eq.:  +0,675 ( -0,282)
       0,643 0,260 0,030 - 0,357 0,097 0,005 CL  +0,474 CF  +0,675
18/13* is really bad now. Black has a reasonable piplead that he doesn't want to spoil. He also doesn't want to facilitate white in getting an advanced anchor.

Moving 12w to 17:
White - Pips 132

Black - Pips 142
Code:
    1. bar/23 18/13*                Eq.:  +0,506
       0,627 0,200 0,014 - 0,373 0,120 0,007 CL  +0,340 CF  +0,506
      
    2. bar/18                       Eq.:  +0,470 ( -0,035)
       0,622 0,124 0,004 - 0,378 0,063 0,002 CL  +0,306 CF  +0,470
Just for curiosity.

Moving 8b to 5:

White - Pips 137

Black - Pips 139
Code:
    1. bar/18                       Eq.:  +0,829
       0,694 0,183 0,006 - 0,306 0,052 0,002 CL  +0,524 CF  +0,829
  
    2. bar/23 18/13*                Eq.:  +0,599 ( -0,230)
       0,635 0,254 0,025 - 0,365 0,117 0,007 CL  +0,424 CF  +0,599
In the original position black can make the 4-point with 43, 42, 32, 22, 44. In addition black can make the 4-point now with 41, 31, 21, 11 (and 52 for the 3-point). That's enough for a relative equity difference of more than 0,1.

Conclusion:
Safe play is superior because it gives black a better opportunity to lengthen his prime, he has a small piplead, and his homeboard is not much better.

However, if you are the better player the hitting play might be better because it will lead to many more difficult positions.
Open your mind Quote
05-05-2015 , 11:20 AM
Position ID: uL2DAEGbmR0IEA Match ID: QwkGAAAAAAAE

White - Pips 124

Black - Pips 107
Black to Play 4-1
Created with www.BGdiagram.com
Open your mind Quote
05-05-2015 , 11:44 AM
Hit and lift looks right to me. A spare on the 4pt is a useful builder for the 3pt. Black may still hit outside to further delay White's reentry, while waiting for a 6 or 51 to escape.

Mike
Open your mind Quote

      
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