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Protecting bb Protecting bb

12-03-2012 , 08:56 AM
Hello.

I had view 4 video on DC where player play all tourney and don't protect bb with hands like j2, j3, j4, t2, t3, t4, t5, 94, 95.

I found myself protecting bb with j4, j3, t5, 95 regularly if no crazy opponent and with lowest of theses hands when think opp can payoff if i hit anything.

What your opinion about theses hands to protect bb and what factors is important when deciding to protect or not?
Is them to weak to play versus most opponents?

(all hands is off-suit)

Thanks.

Last edited by kamitis; 12-03-2012 at 09:20 AM.
12-03-2012 , 11:08 PM
My default is to play all of the hands listed from the bb.

ymmv
12-04-2012 , 04:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by themuppets
My default is to play all of the hands listed from the bb.

ymmv
I am more confused about why that player not played them. O.o He was like playing 20$ sng and making video for DC. O.o
12-04-2012 , 08:11 AM
Not sure. They didn't even have husng videos last time I was subscribed so I don't even know who the player is. $20 husngs aren't very big in the larger scheme of things, so even though he's playing bigger stakes than you are now, there's not necessarily any implication that it takes a really high level of play in order to beat them.

You might ask him directly if he's still active on the site. Without seeing the video, it's hard to speculate whether he may have had any good reason to do so.

In your opinion, why do we include such hands in our default range?
12-04-2012 , 09:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by themuppets
In your opinion, why do we include such hands in our default range?
With top of theses hands i think we are lead to lot of players 80-90% open range. With button of theses hands i think we have enough win odds to call, we don't have position but i don't think it make us win odds smaller then our pot odds (25%). Exception to protect all them may be if opponent is real nit, i should also fold button of theses hands if opp is maniac who have rock on his raise button.

Hmm... what really is default most used protect range in % from bb?
12-04-2012 , 11:47 AM
i don't play T4- and 94-, but the others i defend. gotta let some of those go, esp if you 3bet reasonably. you can't c/f too many flops.
12-04-2012 , 09:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kamitis
With top of theses hands i think we are lead to lot of players 80-90% open range. With button of theses hands i think we have enough win odds to call, we don't have position but i don't think it make us win odds smaller then our pot odds (25%). Exception to protect all them may be if opponent is real nit, i should also fold button of theses hands if opp is maniac who have rock on his raise button.
Yeah, I think you're on the right track. In addition to the above, we don't even have to profit from these hands -- as long as we lose less than 1 bb on average when calling, we're doing better than if we had folded. It also makes it difficult for villain to discount our ability to hit low cards, which decreases his ability to take exploitative lines on flops we would otherwise be less likely to connect with. Finally, we're typically playing against bad players, and it's good to play lots of hands versus poor opponents.

Although I was tempted to clarify your comment about the nitty player, I guess we can assume you mean someone who doesn't open super wide pf.

Quote:
Hmm... what really is default most used protect range in % from bb?
This is an interesting question just because I think you'll find a pretty wide range of opinions on the subject. For example, I prefer to play slightly tighter from the bb because I think the positional disadvantage postflop will outweigh other considerations in the long run. Other players play near if not 100% from the bb, in part because they feel they have odds to call anything versus a wide opener. We could maybe have bachfan run some hands to get a feel for what his bot does.
12-05-2012 , 01:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by themuppets
Although I was tempted to clarify your comment about the nitty player, I guess we can assume you mean someone who doesn't open super wide pf.
I assume i fold versus player who don't open wide because i am dominated pretty often.
12-05-2012 , 10:21 AM
I fold these hands unless one of three conditions are met: the guy doesn't bet enough allowing me to realize more of my preflop equity; the guy's a spewer allowing me to more than compensate any preflop disadvantage with implied odds(who says 93o is a rio hand when the guy will 5 bet bluff the turn? It's not); I feel I can show a profit check raising the flop and betting the turn with any 2.

      
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