Anyone with any reputable ipoker rakeback deal, could they please pm me. Many thanks.

yay new software for chili, way better than before imo. what does everyone think?

I'm still on the very old version -- am I missing anything, besides resizable tables?

I've had new chili for ages?

any one happen to know neone in monaco who would lend/swap live for online money in the next day? need 20k euro min

I don't know, mine is new, kind of like a mix between the old one and the last one.

Omg are tables supposed to be this ****ing bad?????

Yes!!! He has a super tagfish nit mode, and a scandinavian paranoid LAG mode. I can't believe I never suspected it. Both seem capable of thought processes the other is incapable of so it'd be impossible for a non schizophrenic to switch between the 2.

haha

I'm back on ipoker after a longish break, playing ssnl atm, but I notice a bunch of guys playing the same stakes that used to play 2/4+, and they're just the guys that have kept the same name. Kinda worries me a bit. Have the games gotten that much worse?

Quit two months ago, was only playing pro for 18 months but it is seriously the best decision I have ever made. working a real job and LOVING the lack of stress in my life.

Really? I kinda admire that. I actually can't imagine myself doing anything else, poker is all I've done for the last couple of years. Not sure I could actually take on a real job, for the moment anyway, once I finish college + masters hopefully, it'll be different.

I've been pro for 4 years, in the process of easing myself back into the workforce. Doing a web application job for someone as we speak actually. I have a degree in computer science so that's the work I'll probably return to. I'm lucky enough to have a boss at my last job who I'm certain would hire me back, he insta offered me a $10K/year raise when I quit 4 years ago. He's also quite flexible as regards working hours so I'm thinking of going to him and proposing that he give me a job having a massive amount of annual leave (like 3 months/year hopefully) for a correspondingly lower salary. What I like about poker is the good amount of leisure time and flexibility to go travelling etc, if I could retain that while holding a job that would be ideal.

The other thing I realised about poker is that I'm not like you grinders out there playing like 80K hands a month, I think I only ever went above 50K hands once or twice and mostly was more around the 30K hands mark. I found multitabling too overstimulating to do any more than that, if I played 100K hands in a month I would be a nervous wreck unable to sleep. Playing like 8-10 tables 30K hands/month is probably only averaging 2 hrs/day or so, which is very doable even working a job. Hour or two before work on weekdays (early morning is the best time to play in Australia) and a few hours each on Sat/Sun, ez game. If required can use some of the money to live closer to job to make commute near zero.

I definitely think anyone playing poker for money atm needs to have a plan B. I know there's been "games are dying" doom-mongers around since the dawn of online poker, but I have in fact been playing since the dawn of online poker (like a decade now) and I'm pretty sure it's different this time. There's a ton of information out there on how to play well and heaps of competent players rising up from amongst the legion of SSNL players (clarkatroid had a thread about this a while back). I also think bots are on the cusp of making a big impact on online poker, even in MSNL, and this will be a big problem over the next 5 years or so. Some of the better players on this thread may be able to hold out for a while longer, but for those such as myself who were never very good at poker in the first place, the squeeze is already underway.

Sure games are getting tougher, but there will always be fish. Plus, while most regs have decent fundamentals, alot of them are pretty bad, and simply dont put the effort in to get better. Its not THAT hard to become better than most of the regs floating around SSNL, you can still make a pretty damm good living crushing those stakes.

Maybe I'm wrong and it will always be possible for anyone with a brain and an internet connection to make $10K+ a month without doing much work. If that's the case in 5 years time, I can give my notice to my employer again and in the space of two weeks be playing full time.

But suppose you're wrong and in 5 years time the profitability of online poker has nosedived. What will you do then?

If you don't have a good answer to this question, you need to think about it. I'm not saying everyone ITT needs to prepare to give up poker immediately. I'm saying you need a plan B.

This is pretty sobering to read Chris. I've never taken these posts seriously because people have been saying "games are dying" ever since I started playing NL but coming from you it's a concern.

I've basically been ****ing around travelling and playing live donkaments all year and now I'm worried I've been wasting valuable time and money.

My backup plan was always live poker, although I don't enjoy live cash any more, so it's not much of a plan.

Nothing wrong with ****ing around travelling, that is never a waste of time. You just have to realise the tradeoffs you're making. Every year you spend playing poker is a year you're not climbing the ladder in any other career, and a year you have to explain to future employers. As long as you can clear 10K a month it's definitely worth it but that actually isn't that easy to do at 1/2 even as the games stand. 40K hands @ 8bb/100 is $6,400 at 1/2, add rakeback and you still won't make it to 10K. Virtually nobody is making 8bb/100 at 2/4+ anymore, how long is 1/2 going to hold out?

Again, what I'm saying is not "everybody panic", but that you need to have a plan and think honestly about what the future might hold. If you're having fun now and don't care that your career might be in the toilet if poker evaporates, that's OK as long as you've thought about it. "lol I will always make straight cash grinding because I am l33t at poker" isn't thinking honestly about it unless you are actually l33t at poker, which most of MSNL is not.

Yeah this may be a realistic option for those who can hack it but I would pretty much rather die than play live poker professionally. I can't think of many things I'd less rather do. Would prefer to be a janitor or taxi driver I think.

I think regardless of what one does you need to have a plan B. whether you are in Consulting, Law, social work or poker.

I to have been exposed to "poker is dieing" since the dawn of time. I for one dont think poker will ever "die". The landscape will continue to change/evolve much like any other industry. You need to look no further than the events in the Technology industry in the late 90's early 00's as evidence.

I think it is also silly to believe that that you can play a card game and expect to make insane amounts of money into perpituity (Income trends ALWAYS had to revert to a more realistic number).

Rather look at other aspects that poker might offer an individual (freedom, no employer, tax benefits). I have been exposed to the stress of corporate employment and its deadlines, backstabbing, long days and working weekends. I know which i prefer.

Cheers

I agree with having a plan B. Im just collecting degrees part time while im playing, up to 3 now inc law. Though will obviously still be tough getting a decent job in a few years with SFA work experience, but meh. Poker > working imo, at least while you are young, and espeically if you take advantage of the freedom it affords you

Yeah this is pretty much what I was trying to say in one sentence form. Thing is, if poker gets to the point where I need to play 6 hours a day, spend time outside that studying to improve my game, and subject myself to the stress of playing all day every day against mostly good players all so I can earn just an ordinary wage, then it's well down the list of things I want to do, and I don't think I'd be alone in this thread on that.

Edit: You also need to realise that this is going to be subject to some pretty vicious globalization, like to someone in a poor country if they can grind out 4K a month that's absurdly good money, whereas here I would not consider it worth it, at least not to do full time. Basically we'll get forced out of the market by people willing to exploit fish for a lower wage.

I guess how much it depends on how much you like poker, and how much you would hate a realjoblol. I enjoy taking time outside of playing to study, and for as long as I make >100k a year tax free I wont be doing anything else

If u are a decent winner at msnl, unless you have amazing qualifications to get a cool job(one worth doing and highly paid), I think the best thing to do is grind like mad and use poker as finance for business opportunities.
Regardless if poker is the same as it is now in +15 years, who the hell wants to be grinding on a computer when you are like 40.

I'm in your situation pretty much Chris, except I've always worked part-time as an analyst programmer, and played poker for travel/drinking money. I work Tues-Friday 9-5 and play in the morning before work and on the weekend/Monday to put in volume.

Not really worried about the doomsayers, because I've always had the backup. One thing I can't stress enough is that having poker as only a lucrative hobby - and not needing it to pay the rent - does wonders for opening up your game, tolerance to variance, life balance, everything.

Yeah, like I have 400K or something in the bank so it's not like I need poker money week to week. But it's still stressful because when you go through a period of getting crushed, you start feeling like you're wasting your life and can't win anymore etc. And you don't want to drop limits or tables because you feel like you can't.