View Single Post
Old 03-07-2008, 06:02 PM   #1
The Bryce
Stoxpoker Sponsored Forum
 
The Bryce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 4,245
Let's Have a Discussion about Open-Raise Sizes: Raising OOP

The second topic I had wanted to discuss was raising OOP, and how the stacks getting deeper affects OOP play in general. From this first thread we can summarize the points about GTO play neatly into three points:

1) As the quality of your range increases you should raise a larger amount with a wider range of hands
2) As the stacks become deeper the effective quality of the range of the player in position increases, on a diminishing curve
3) As stacks become deeper, then, the player in position should scale his or her bet size upwards, to some unknown degree

Optimal exploitive strategy may deviate wildly from this, of course, depending on the tenancies of the opponent in question.

Now, if the above is true, let's take a look at the converse:

1) As the quality of your range decreases you should raise a smaller amount with a narrower range of hands
2) As the stacks become deeper the effective quality of the range of the player out of position decreases, on a diminishing curve
3) As stacks become deeper, then, the player out of position should scale his or her raise size downwards, to some unknown degree

Now here are some interesting points that go along with that:

It is likely possible to play with deep enough stacks that playing any hand but AA (which will have to push) OOP is unprofitable in GTO strategy (either for a call or for a raise). With infinite betting streets this would certainly be the case.

Because most players do not scale their bet-sizing in position according to the stacks, however, there is a soft cap on how deep the stacks can effectively be, regardless of actual stack size. If we look at a mini-game where we are check-calling down with TP, and can make no other actions, for example, we won't really care whether our opponent has 100BB or 500BB if he open-raises to 3x and bets only in proportion to the pot post-flop.

Typically it seems that players OOP tend to re-raise either larger or same amounts as the stacks get deeper with a narrower range of hands, which is an exploitive strategy based on the assumption that our opponents will play poorly against these re-raises. To look at a case of extremes, however, you might often be very happy to make one re-raise size with AK with 100BB stacks, but would not feel comfortable making that same re-raise size, or larger, with 1000BB stacks.

That's what I have for now. Feel free to chime in with additional input on the GTO side of things (or corrections if I've mucked anything up) and I'd like to hear any comments on exploitive strategies as well.

Last edited by The Bryce; 03-07-2008 at 06:27 PM.
The Bryce is offline